preparing a classic for sale

Robert The Gray · Post by **Robert The Gray** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:38 pm

Hello all,

I have decided for a variety of reasons to part with my Triton. I intend to put her on the market around March. I have a limited amount of time and money to spend on the boat to prepare her for fetching the highest price. In the experience of the members of this forum:

What some general rules about preparing a boat for sale?
Are there key things that add to the chance of selling, if the asking price is basically within market standards.

I intend to have the varnish inside and out looking good.
engine oil changed
washed boat
buffed out topsides
washed cushion covers.

I hope to ask specific questions about specific projects on the boat in the projects section

I really like my boat and it is mostly financial circumstances that compel me to part with her. I figure that selling this boat well now will allow me to get another boat that much easier in the future. We do not always get to choose our adventures but one can maintain an adventurous spirit. With that in mind I have been having fun with the imagined ad copy:

Adventure boat for sale. The grip of the modern is everywhere warping our perception of the true reason for sailing. The chimera of the man on man contest turns the holy waters into just another arena. The boats into empty mathematics. To the others that hear another call, a call to the real do not despair of finding your Harley in a sea of Kawasakis. Presenting the Triton. She's heavy man. Some like a certain feel to the helm, a look to the lines that both creates and resolves tension at the same time. The Triton spirals the eye and desire together to compel one to the voyage regardless of how far. Arrive at the dock. Raise the sails. Shut down the motor and fly out into a world beyond the confines of the breakwater. This glorious freedom can be yours for only $******

I swear people write boat ads like they are selling tractors. No one needs a sail boat. It seems to me that it's about selling the dream or then again maybe I have an obnoxiously overblown writing style.

I look forward to all of your suggestions of good things to do when selling a boat.

r

triton #227 · Post by **triton #227** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 9:45 pm

That sounds like a great ad, it would defently get my attention when reading the listings.

Figment · Post by **Figment** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:16 pm

"She's a heavy man."

Damn, that's good.

And "hemmorhoutboard" is the best I can do. Oh how will I ever be worthy?

bcooke · Post by **bcooke** » Thu Jan 03, 2008 10:43 pm

Robert, you make me sad :-(

Do you need someone to take care of her for a bit and relieve you of the expense or do you really need the cash the boat sale would bring in?

Does this mean the PCF will lose its official poet?

And I like the listing. I am not sure the average boating public is capable of appreciating the artistry though. On the other hand you probably don't want some dirty land peasant sailing your boat away either...

-Britton

Post by **Tim** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 8:02 am

Robert,

All enjoyment of your golden prose aside--and it truly is enjoyable--I'd suggest a more practical approach to the listing. Serious buyers want to know about the boat, and the more information up front the better. I am hopelessly practical and almost certainly boring as all get out, I'm afraid, but the idea of selling your boat is to sell your boat. There are plenty of dreamers already: they don't need help. Most potential Triton buyers already know that they're looking for a Triton, and will find and read your ad without help.

If you want calls from a lot of unprepared, rosy-eyed tire-kickers, that's fine, but realistically, a person looking at your boat already has "The Dream" in one form or another, and now needs some hard information about your boat in order to translate that dream into reality. These are the potential buyers you really want.

Basics to preparing the boat itself:

1. Get her clean and neat, and keep her clean and neat

2. Refresh your brightwork

3. Get rid of any personal gear that doesn't stay with the boat after the sale, and get rid of any junk from the lockers.

4. Speaking of lockers: clean the lockers and bilges. Clean the engine room and engine.

5. Take lots of pictures of the boat from all angles, inside and out, and include photos of the engine and important gear or systems.

Boat listing basics, whether owner-sold or broker-sold:

1. Lots of pictures (see #5 above)

2. Forget fancy poetic license. Instead, just accurately describe the boat's condition and list salient equipment. Don't gloss over any issues: far too many potential buyers have traveled to look at boats that sound great, but fail to live up to their descriptions in person. Instead, try being honest and up front, which will likely make people like your boat better in person than they were prepared to. Don't guess at your engine hours: you either know, or you don't.

3. Price her accurately, and realistically, and don't forget to always include the price in any listing. Don't go for the pie-in-the-sky price: pick a price you can live with, allow for a bit of negotiating room, and don't mess around. Remember that Triton prices tend to be lower than we'd all like--unfortunate, but true.

4. Be prepared to spend time, by email, phone, or in person, with prospective buyers. Surprise them by offering honest and abundant information about the boat, rather than the expected taciturn and unhelpful responses typically encountered in the boat-buying process.

5. Keep the boat ready to be shown at all times, and be flexible in your ability to meet prospective buyers or otherwise allow them to view the boat.

6. Be as realistically open to buyer needs, offers, and suggestions as possible. Don't make it hard to see the boat in person. Entertain reasonable offers. Be prepared for a buyer's survey to locate some issues that you may have been unaware of, and be prepared to deal with them through negotiation or other means.

7. If you don't really want to sell the boat, then don't. Only sell her if you're serious. No one likes a seller who doesn't seem to care about selling the boat (see #4), and these sellers usually don't succeed.

Oh, and good luck...and I will join others in expressing my sorrow that you have determined a need or desire to sell. Don't be a stranger either way!

MikeD · Post by **MikeD** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 9:59 am

Suggestions? Post your ad here. There's probably a lurker out there familiar with your boat and projects who is already emailing with questions.

Best of luck with all of it. I hope you find a steward worthy of her.

JonnyBoats · Post by **JonnyBoats** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 12:30 pm

I would like to suggest that facts and documentation are far more important to a buyer than dreams and hype.

If you had the engine overhalled, do you have a receipt showing in detail the work performed for example? If you can show a potential buyer a detailed service record with receipts and documentation it establishes clearly that the boat is well cared for.

Also don't make claims that just plain are not true. How many times have you seen a listing for a boat as "fully found and ready for world crusing" and then seen that it has one 10 lb. Danforth anchor with 5 ft of chain and 100 ft of nylon rhode? When I see something like this I immediately _assume_ that the seller is puffing and the boat is probably difficient in other ways as well.

Rachel · Post by **Rachel** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 1:20 pm

Robert The Gray wrote:...or then again maybe I have an obnoxiously overblown writing style.

Oh no, I'd say it's delightfully overblown ;^)

That said, I definitely agree with Tim as far as what I'd look for in a boat ad. SO many boat owners I contacted were completely unprepared and made me feel like a bother asking for information. Or acted like they didn't want to sell (well fine then, don't put up for sale!) I don't know about the ads with no price, because I have a personal policy against even contacting them.

On the other hand, we may be toward the practical end of the spectrum, and maybe there's room for both?

"Enjoy your morning coffee on the deck of this 2-bedroom bungalow, while Jones Creek sparkles in the sunlight" is more inviting than "2-bedroom single-story house near river" but still gives the same information. So I guess that while I wouldn't want to give up any of the factual information, I might not be against a more congenial, moody introduction. And we know you can write that better than anyone else here.

Rachel

Robert The Gray · Post by **Robert The Gray** » Fri Jan 04, 2008 4:20 pm

Great responses every one and of course I am and will forever be a sailor. I have this page seared into my bookmarks. Fantastic list Tim, and just the thing I was looking for. I do agree a more practical ad would draw in the buyer I am looking for, but thanks for your appreciation of the writing. I think when I am buying advertising by the word the more nouns and fewer adjectives would be better. If I create a flyer or add a page to my website then I can add a few more flowers to the prose. I am determined to sell the boat, and intend to price it accordingly. I have never been able to "sell" as in trick a buyer into paying more than they should. I feel that honesty leads to fewer assumptions and fewer people in the world who talk bad about you.

feel free to add any more suggestions everyone.

r

jollyboat · Post by **jollyboat** » Sat Jan 05, 2008 2:04 pm

Robert - what on earth are you thinking man! - Just mothball the boat for now. Spend a little time finding a place to store it for free or close to it - cover it well and come back to your boat when time and money allows. Having trucked my own Triton 346 out to Oakland myself - I can attest that Oakland and Bay area on a whole is one of the least expensive places to be a boat owner - especially since you can sail year round and are in one of the best sailing environments on the west coast. Now having said that - I too have sold a Triton and in Oakland as well - my boat sold in 1 day - but within 12 months I bought another. Tim is correct in his advise of course - I did the same thing and the buyer was very happy to be shown a clean boat with the extras organized - clean and out of the boat to be seen and inspected. Everything must be clean. Empty the boat completely. When I sold 346 everything worked from lights to motor, to lamps to new sails and running rigging and canvas. Done deal.
Try to spend some time making repairs on as much as you can that are easy to do and will not cost a lot if anything.

FloatingMoneyPit · Post by **FloatingMoneyPit** » Sun Jan 06, 2008 4:58 am

jollyboat wrote:I can attest that Oakland and Bay area on a whole is one of the least expensive places to be a boat owner

Jollyboat, would you mind elaborating on this a little?
I've just relocated to SF, but my boat is drydocked in the Bahamas awaiting repair. I'm leaning towards selling her in Florida instead of shipping her out here, mostly because what little research I've done has indicated sparse slip availability, expensive dry storage, no DIY yards, etc. Would appreciate any bay area insight. It'd be great to have my boat out here.
Actually, I guess Robert's slip will (sadly) be vacant soon...

keelbolts · Post by **keelbolts** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:11 am

If I lived some place I couldn't afford to keep my boat, I'd have to move. It's a question of priorities.

jollyboat · Post by **jollyboat** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:55 am

Floating Money Pit -
Because there are few if any mooring fields in the Bay, dockage is pretty much the only option out side of dry sailing - which is not a viable option for your Tartan. Because much of the waterfront marinas are owned and run by the cities and towns around the bay it helps very much to keep the dockage rates lower. In 2002 I was paying about $250.00 per month for my Triton slip. This included parking, trash, fresh water, security, and shore facilities including hot showers, and laundry. It truly is a boat bums dream come true. I kept my boat in various locations including the Berkeley Marina (city), the Alameda Marina (privately owned) and the Oakland south Basin Marina (behind Coast Guard Island (city). I also investigated the San Francisco City marinas at Chrissie Field as well as the private San Francisco marina that is next to Pac Bell Park (SF GIANTS). Though the San Francisco marinas were typically at capacity, slips did become available but you have to be ready to take the spot when it comes up. The issue that I did not like about the San Francisco marinas was the tidal swell - fairly significant, as well as the seals, which make a mess of the docks and can cause quite an odor. The east bay, either Oakland or Alameda is best bang for the buck. Berkeley is pretty good but the traffic is hellish. Emeryville I found to be too expensive and much too controlled. Sausalito is another viable option in both price and availabillity. OK - now more info -if you go to the south Bay it really opens up in both availability and price. South San Francisco is also another place to consider. You can also look east - into the estuary towards Sacramento - where it is very warm - much warmer than the bay - starting with the Richmond Bay and further up. This area of the Bay is very fun and a quiet place to sail. In as far DIY yards - I never had a problem as there are many. I can attest for both the Berkeley Marina and Svenson's Marina in Alameda as good marinas where owners can do their own work. The trick with any marina is to do a little research and also keep a low profile. The issues that I had as an east coast sailor having gone west was how regulated some marinas where about how many nights an owner could stay on their boats while in their dock slips - only three per week - otherwise they got pretty uptight – if you want to do more, it is best to anchor out. Being that I was in the Bay for the soul purpose of sailing this was a bummer for me – though I did have my own apartment - I was still on my everyday - this made it look like I was a live-aboard which is HIGHLY regulated in the bay. Otherwise I would strongly recommend that you do not sell your boat but have it trucked out to the Bay and have a blast - it is well worth it.
Maybe you should buy Roberts Triton - he already has a slip too!

Ganges #363 · Post by **Ganges #363** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 2:14 pm

Robert,

If lowering your docking costs will make a difference, you might look toward the Delta, starting with Vallejo. Moving into the Delta itself, you might check out Owl Harbor. It's very economical, and has some Tritons there now. And that area would supply all kinds of new sailing, cruising, and writing opportunities.

There is a funky little marina on your right hand as you enter San Pablo Bay, just past The Brothers. It used to be called San Pablo Yacht Harbor, and was very affordable. Haven't checked it for awhile, but I doubt if it's changed much. You'd want to check on the depth of the entrance, it silts up there.

As for dry storage, the marina on the Napa River has very low long term dry storage rates. Scores of boats are stored there.

Bill
Ganges #363

Robert The Gray · Post by **Robert The Gray** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:22 pm

Good suggestions all, but, not to display to much of my underwear, I am primarily liquidating an asset not just cutting monthly costs. Thanks for your suggestions. It is really quite affordable to keep a boat in the Bay as jollyboat has said. I mostly daysail and find that my sailing doubles when I am closer to the marina. I can go for an evening sail in the summer. Traffic can happen anywhere and additional distance equates to more gas. So while lowering the slip fees by moving the boat out of the area does make some sense, it just will not parse out in the critical dollar per hour of Wind Driven Movement that I desperately need.

I express that ratio as $/WDM. This is one of the ratios within my whole theory of Cross Century Propulsion Therapeutics. In specific: the torsional strain and collapse of the feminine critical scale while referenced to a horizontal scale of time verses a vertical scale of WDM, where as when WDM increases, as taken from a derivative of the occurrence of screaming reaches* within the given solar yaw, the adaptive manor of the conversational spousal relaxability quotient is also know to increase. I know this seems more complex than necessary*, but I have a Masters of HooHaa and am certified by the California Alliance of Flatuent Keyboards. KAFK. Our goal is to conflate the matrix of mild cultural idioms when negatively called by the absence of any request from our wrongly assumed constituents. You personally, have been a great help.

thank you

r

* screaming reaches are rated in a descending numerical grid function with the ground effect of passing any fin keeled boat taken to the next layer of displacement

*I talk nice to my wife after sailing.

bcooke · Post by **bcooke** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 8:58 pm

That, my friend, was a true work of art...

:-)

Rachel · Post by **Rachel** » Mon Jan 07, 2008 10:11 pm

Okay, okay, you can sell the boat. Just don't leave the forum - please! :D

R.

Zach · Post by **Zach** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:15 am

Robert... if spousal pressure is the case, put it on the market for 30k and wait for a buyer. (Grin)

jollyboat · Post by **jollyboat** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 9:02 am

I now want a degree in HooHaa too! English is fine for most things but I now understand [almost] that HooHaa has many advantages over english.

Triton 53 · Post by **Triton 53** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 12:51 pm

Robert,

Maybe you could keep the boat and sell the wife?

Pete

Rachel · Post by **Rachel** » Tue Jan 08, 2008 1:31 pm

Triton 53 wrote:Robert, Maybe you could keep the boat and sell the wife?

Hey now, who said it had anything to do with "the wife"?

Lots of women like boats. I'm just saying. ;D

Rachel

FloatingMoneyPit · Post by **FloatingMoneyPit** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 1:15 am

Jollyboat, Ganges -- great info, thanks!
I was told the chrissy field/fort mason and berkeley marinas had 10+ year waiting lists, but I guess that's hyperbole.

Ganges #363 · Post by **Ganges #363** » Wed Jan 09, 2008 12:54 pm

The San Francisco Marina (Crissy Field) has a legendary waiting list because the city lets boat owners transfer their slips when they sell their boat. About the only way to get in there is to buy a boat, then sell that boat and put your own boat in the slip. Happens a lot. That marina has the advantage of being right on the City Front, but also has lots of surge and wind. There are many better places, unless you need to be right in the City for some reason or most of your sailing is racing in Central Bay.

Try marinas in Richmond, Oakland, Alameda, South San Francisco and Sausalito. Marina Bay in Richmond would be a good place to start for availability and rates. And I wouldn't count out Berkeley.

Bill
Ganges #363

David VanDenburgh · Post by **David VanDenburgh** » Thu Jan 17, 2008 10:08 pm

Robert (et al),

Here's one for you.

David

Robert The Gray · Post by **Robert The Gray** » Sat Jan 19, 2008 8:21 pm

I really can't type that much. And another thing they have land in america that costs only $17,000? wood boat in ecuador, I don't know...

r

Robert The Gray · Post by **Robert The Gray** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 12:46 am

update:
I have found a buyer for whisper, we will have a period of sharing the boat over the summer and then he gets the title in sep. Great deal for the both of us. his name is Michael.

r

Figment · Post by **Figment** » Tue Apr 01, 2008 11:18 am

Excellent! That sounds like a great way to transition stewardship. Congrats/condolences all around.

Triton106 · Post by **Triton106** » Mon Jul 14, 2008 11:46 pm

Robert,

I happened to be in Berkeley marina last weekend and saw Whisper in person for the first time. Boy, she looks great and very distinctive with the yawl rigging you added. It also looks like the new owner is taking a pretty good care of it. I also saw couple of other west coast Tritons in the same marina, including Aweigh which is also in a great shape. Some of the other Tritons are in need of some serious TLC. I wish all of the owners can take care of this classic the same way you have. There are four Tritons in Grand Marina now including Head Over Heels, Blossom, Juno, and another one I cannot think of the name now. There are a couple of Tritons in the Alameda Marina next to us, including Answer. I hope you will find your way back to a Triton. Love to see the modifications you make.

Best regards,

Ray

Robert The Gray · Post by **Robert The Gray** » Tue Jul 15, 2008 10:28 pm

thanks ray.

Plastic Classic Forum