Calling CaptK

CharlieJ · Post by **CharlieJ** » Sun Sep 18, 2005 3:16 pm

Hey Kurt- how did Ophelia treat you, Katie Marie and the crewdogs??

Inquiring minds want to know. Let us hear from ya bud!!

Post by **CapnK** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:59 pm

Edit: I just read the post about Jason and Triton #218 - wanted to point out that we were *very* fortunate compared to those affected by Katrina (my uncles house in Waveland, Miss is now just a foundation and the low deck off the back of it). Keeping my fingers crossed for #218!

Came out of it OK, I guess. I enjoyed the peace of my hurricane hole so much that I only took Katie Marie back to the marina yesterday, 5 days post-storm. :D I love living on the hook even more than at the marina. Anyway, I'll be writing the whole thing up and putting it on my site in a few days, with some pics and short videos.

It wasn't as bad a storm as Charlie was last year, my hurricane hole is a *great* spot. Once in and all tied up, the storm itself was almost a non-event, as far as effects to/on the boat. Still, I got enough "material" out of it for a pretty good story, in the vein of a Tom Parrent tale, if you know what I mean. :)

One item from the Bad News/Good News department;

Bad News: Waited kind of late to leave the marina (since the Ophelia forecast didn't seem to match at all what Ophelia *was doing*), the wind was so strong I almost couldn't make it upriver. Once I got into my hole, while setting a hook I got blown down on a tree. Lesson #1: Don't just watch the trunk, watch the *branches*, too! I didn't, and the spreader-eating tree caused one of my spreader bases to literally shatter into pieces when it grabbed my port upper shroud...

Good News: The spreader base didn't shatter when I was under sail, so I didn't dismast. :D

I'm fairly certain these are the OEM, circa '67 bases, and, being cast aluminum, I'd already assumed that they were weaker than I'd prefer. One of the pieces shot out and landed on deck, if you look at it's broken edge, there is less than 1/8" sq. of shiny metal in evidence (ie; new broken metal), so I think that the cast aluminum was already cracked and ready to explode like it did.

There is a source for some slightly heavier, bronze bases listed on the Ariel site that I can get for about $125, so that's not too bad. I'd been planning on replacing them anyway, so this incident is just precipitating that and some other work I need to do on the mast and to the strongback, and as such I didn't even cuss a whole lot when it happened. :D

Hope that you and Laura aren't getting this next storm!

Post by **CapnK** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 1:10 pm

A couple pics of the damage...

You can see that the spreader is still almost in place (but I'm not sailing with it like that! :-) ). Prior to the stronger winds, I did get a messenger line around it in case it came loose during the storm, but that never happened. It's still in that same spot as in these pics. I may have to secure it better before I drop the mast. It'll be a couple weeks or so before I deal with it. Have to buy the new bases, and, while the mast is down I'm also going to replace the anchor light and steaming light with some USCG-certified LED fixtures I saw at Boaters World. Currently, one of the worst leaks on my boat are the wires to those two fixtures - somehow water is getting into them up top, and so it runs down into the boat along the wire, inside the jacket, so that'll get fixed, too. And while it's down I'm going to see about reinforcing Katie's saggy strongback.

So this is an "opportunity" to get it all done at once, right? ;)

CharlieJ · Post by **CharlieJ** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 2:40 pm

Great!! Very glad to hear you fared well. Sorta glad you DID destroy that base the way it sounds- far better then than on a hard rail down slog, huh?

We are making preliminary plans and schedules in case we need to do something with this storm. 24 hours ago she was heading for Mexico. 12 hours ago she was pointed right down our throats, NOW she seems to be heading for Galveston. Hey- by tomorrow she may be heading to New Orleans f'r cry'nout loud!!! We won't REALLY shift into gear til Tuesday night or Weds morning- still way to far away to pinpoint.

Oh- bet ya can't guess what my ex wifes name is? Yep- you got it!!!

Post by **dasein668** » Mon Sep 19, 2005 3:29 pm

That looks so close to exactly like what mine looked like after Glissando and I smashed rigs that it is scary.

No recs on bronze ones, short of casting them yourself...

Post by **Tim** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:12 am

I bought new cast aluminum spreader bases from D&R Marine (www.drmarine.com). They are identical to the original cast bases like you have, though they are of course in better condition. The old cast bases turn into something like wet concrete over time, and there are many recent reports of cracks and damage.

The new bases were something like $106 for the pair (several years ago), as I recall. They do the job, but in hindsight I probably should have done a more significant upgrade.

If I were to consider replacing these bases now, I'd seriously look at having some nice new bases built by a spar maker, along with some new airfoil spreaders. The old tubular spreaders are no treat, and new bases and spreaders are a nice upgrade. None of the old cast parts on the mast give me warm fuzzy feelings at this point, though all are serviceable.

Obviously this would cost a lot more than replacing the bases with original-style. I've had good experiences with Metalmast Marine in Putnam CT; they do very nice work, and do a lot of custom jobs. If you're in the mood to do a lifetime upgrade to your spar, given the recent damage, then you might consider revamping the whole spreader arrangement.

Post by **Tim** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 6:18 am

CapnK wrote:There is a source for some slightly heavier, bronze bases listed on the Ariel site that I can get for about $125...

For what it's worth, I think mixing bronze hardware on an aluminum mast is a serious recipe for disaster--the corrosion potential is very high here, much worse than the stainless/aluminum mix.

Aluminum and bronze are widely separated on the galvanic corrosion scale, creating larger potential between the two metals. If you don't use aluminum for your spar parts, use stainless steel. There's still a galvanic corrosion potential, of course, but much less than with bronze in this instance.

bcooke · Post by **bcooke** » Mon Sep 26, 2005 7:11 pm

If I were to consider replacing these bases now, I'd seriously look at having some nice new bases built by a spar maker, along with some new airfoil spreaders.

As you mention further on this isn't the cheapest option. Really, reading between the lines, your advice on rigging is "throw it all out and buy all new". The more I think about it the more sense it makes to me.

-Britton

Post by **CapnK** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:39 am

Tim -

Actually, it was an offshoot of the aluminum bases you bought which led me to the bronze ones I spoke of. You posted to a thread at the Ariel site back in '03 about the aluminum bases (Link)

which led to someone else, a "commanding pete" or somesuch (/me ducks), posting about these bronze ones in the same thread, albeit much later:

If I could get aluminum ones, I'd go for it - you are exactly right about the galvanic potential. The aluminum bases lasted just fine for 37+ years, I'm sure new ones would be fine for 15 years or so before needing replacment again, say three wire changes per base change. 15 years of SS against the aluminum spar might not look too good, but it might also be fine - as it was on my last boat. Anyway, I haven't looked into the whole issue in depth yet, to see what exactly is available. I can say this: I'd prefer to mix my drinks, not my spar metals. ;) I will eventually replace all standing rigging and terminals, chainplates, etc, but will probably continue to use my Triton-spec spar and spreaders since the strength there is so overblown for the Ariel, which is such a smaller boat. The Triton is about 4,000# more than my little 5,200# Ariel, so that's a good ratio. I ran the load numbers a la Toss once, they looked real nice for my eventual plan of offshore journeying.

I like it that way. :)

Of course, given the kind of budget and time it would take (which right now I don't have a lot extra of either :)), a complete overhaul and upgrade would not be a bad thing at all.

Maybe I could take some aluminum flashing and give the round tubes an airfoil look...

Not. :D

Post by **CapnK** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:45 am

Nathan -

I just missed enrollment in the community college Bronze Casting class. Oh darn.

I do see that the Ceramics Class doesn't start until next week, though...

j/k

:D

Kurt

Post by **CapnK** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:49 am

Britton -

My last boat, I replaced everything on the rig except the spar and spreaders, and including the bases (with improved bases). A tad expensive, but worth every penny for peace of mind in a blow. :)

Kurt

Post by **Tim** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 6:03 am

bcooke wrote:As you mention further on this isn't the cheapest option. Really, reading between the lines, your advice on rigging is "throw it all out and buy all new". The more I think about it the more sense it makes to me.

Well, sort of...but not really.

There does reach a point, however, where it stops making sense to replace all the parts and just go for broke (literally) and buy something new. Obviously this puts me in a quandary since replacing parts is exactly what I do with these old boats, rather than buying a new boat, but despite that oxymoronic tendency, with spars it does make sense. This is where I found myself with the boom on my boat last year.

That said, I am in no hurry to replace my mast extrusion, as it is in good shape, particularly now that it's painted. But that wouldn't stop me from considering new spreaders and bases down the road either, which I will probably do eventually. My jumper bases are in pretty sad shape--I had to epoxy one together in a panic days before launch this year (it held up fine all season), so I will probably address those this winter. More to come on that.

bcooke · Post by **bcooke** » Tue Sep 27, 2005 8:27 am

I'd prefer to mix my drinks, not my spar metals

Sounds like a good candidate for next season's bachelor cruise. Interested? hehe

I was exagerating a bit with the "just buy new" philosophy but it does seem like the line is a little different with the rigging than with other parts. I don't have any immediate plans to retire my mainmast but seeing all the mediocre additions that have been done to it doesn't help my overall worry factor much.

A tad expensive, but worth every penny for peace of mind in a blow. :)

And that is exactly what I am looking for. As Tim and Nathan saw, my rigging is pretty Mickey Moused and any one change leads me to the next inevitable one so the question will be where to stop. I should have just ordered the custom built Hinckley. The price difference probably wouldn't be as great as I once thought... but what is the fun in that :-)

-Britton