'nother bilge pump and sink drain question...

[Tommy Bahama]

My Islander Bahama 24 did not have a bilge pump when I got it... and may not of ever had one installed? The bilge area and access is pretty small so i'm considering a "remote" pump with a syphon hose for the bilge.

That part should be easy enough and I'll most likely mount it behind
the aft bulkhead (supports forward cockpit to hull). The thru-hull is a different story. I have 4 through hulls; two for the head (not in use because I have a porta potty instead) one for the sink and one for the cockpit drain. The question is, where to route the bilge pump discharge. The cockpit drain may be the most practical (forward end of cockpit, straight down to the thru-hull) and I can "Y" into it and make an anti syphon loop that is higher than the cockpit...nice, short run. The other option would be to make a thru-hull into the motor well and let it drain there. I'm not real excited about drilling a new hole through the hull though...and making one more reason to need a bilge pump ;.)


So, what do you have and how does it work for you?


Sink plumbing is still to be completed (i'm hoping to launch by
April). A new pump/faucet is easy, the tank "appears" to be in good
shape but the previous owner replaced the old seacocks with ball
valves. They are new and in good shape but obviously higher off the
hull than a seacock would be...the sink drain dosen't line up with the
ball valve due to angle and the small amount of space between the
two...what to do? Torture the flex hose with heat...naw. use a thinner
grade of hose?...to scary. Maybe use a longer run of reinforced tubing
and making a loop (trap) verses a straight run?...may be the best
idea. Is a PVC type sink drain/trap appropriate between the sink and the ball valve?


I'd appreciate any comments or suggestions.


Thanks,


Tommy

[Hirilondë]

bilge pump:

I firmly believe that bilge pumps should exit above the water line. They are supposed to empty the boat, not fill it up! If you can wye into your cockpit drain line above the waterline, then fine. It is quite likely you can't. Most cockpits on small boats are barely above the waterline. My bilge pump empties into the motor well. The well has its own drain. The outlet is off to the side near the hull and the water then just goes out through the drain as water coming in through the opening for my outboard would.

sink drain:

Traps in household plumbing are for keeping the smell in drain pipes from coming into the house. So you have no useful reason for having one on your boat. It is very likely that the bottom of your sink is barely above the water line. Were you to ad a trap under it you would most likely end up with a drain that barely worked if at all. The trap itself would likely be under water and be another source for potential trouble. If you can't get a hose to go to the ball valve without an uphill portion then I recommend you bight the bullet and get a real seacock that will fit a reasonable configuration.

[Rachel]

Another option for the sink is to forget the below-waterline discharge and instead route the waste-water to a sump and then pump it overboard by manual or electric pump - above the waterline.

Just to replace a seacock installation I don't think I would bother with the above, but if your sink is teeny-tiny in order to keep it above the waterline, and you want a "real" sink, you might consider it.

Rachel

[Tommy Bahama]

Dave, you're blunt and to the point...good for you. I'll check to see if I can tap into the cockpit drain from above the water line. I may, but the motor well will be a good option if it isn't possible. Thanks for pointing that out.

My Cockpit drain doesn't perfectly align with the thru-hull and I think that Tim mentioned getting a similar shaped radiator hose to avoid the kink that is present...almost half constricted as it bends to line-up. Why do boat builders do that? You'd think that having built 500 of the same model that it would be apparent. Should I worry about not being able to see through the hose? I guess all is well as long as it is draining.

Rachel, great Idea! I could put that bilge pump to use, haha. My ice box seems to operate under that principle; it has a drain hose that goes...nowhere! I'll experiment some more with getting a straighter run to the ball valve from the sink. The ball valve is at about a 20 degree angle (flush with hull) while the sink is straight down and about 4 inches of separation.

Really don't need a sink in a boat this size...but it's there!

Thanks you guys. We'd started a small IB24 message board on google...would you mind (Tim) if I steered folks here on occasion? I'll make them swear to behave. For most of us, the Islander and Columbia pocket cruisers are our first real boats and the price leads you into the "great deal" frame of mind ...hahaha! None of us really have the expertise that long-time owners and craftsman do...like most of you on this board. The guidance that isn't available in the Don Casey books is really appreciated. All though he has taught me a lot!

Tommy

[Peter]

Tommy,
Just a quick question: Is the islander 24 Bahama similar/the same as the Columbia Challenger 24?

Edit:
Thanks, Tommy, for the answer below.

[Tommy Bahama]

Peter,

Pretty much the same boat. Lore has it that McGlassen contracted with the newly formed Columbia to build the hulls for the IB24. There was a falling out when Columbia started puting out the same 24' boat under their name...exact hull and raised deck, minus the "lap strakes" of the Islander.

Apparently, Wayfarer (McGlassen/Islander), Columbia and Cal (probably more) all shared the same block in Costa Mesa, CA.

Tommy

[Tim]

My Cockpit drain doesn't perfectly align with the thru-hull and I think that Tim mentioned getting a similar shaped radiator hose to avoid the kink that is present...almost half constricted as it bends to line-up. Why do boat builders do that? You'd think that having built 500 of the same model that it would be apparent. Should I worry about not being able to see through the hose? I guess all is well as long as it is draining.

No, you don't need to be able to see straight through the hose in order for it to work. Most discharge hoses end up with some curves.

There are a lot of space restraints in a small boat that prevent systems from being perfectly aligned, or installed in the best way, or what have you. It can be irritating for owners later in the process, but too often things are originally installed in ways that satisy the marketing personnel and bean counters first, without much regard for usability, future access, or maintenance. And, frankly, there's often just not a setup that always works perfectly based on the overall configuration of the boat, though there's usually room for improvement.

For production builders, the bottom line rules supreme. It's easy to see why production builders do what they do when you see how much time goes into a truly well thought-out boat and systems installations. Most of us can't afford those boats--and even those have their problems. This doesn't mean we have to like what the production builders do, though.

You've already gotten good answers to your questions, so I'm not adding much here, other than to second the call for discharging your bilge pump into your motor well. I think this is a very good way to handle this.

FWIW, my own feeling is that I'd rather install additional through hulls in a boat than overcomplicate existing ones with too many adapters, Y fittings, and so forth. It's these adapters, clamps, and hoses that are more likely to create leakage issues; a well-installed, quality through hull, whether above or below the waterline, is almost never an issue by itself. I'd rather have single hoses going to them, though, then too much Goldberg-esque complication.

Thanks you guys. We'd started a small IB24 message board on google...would you mind (Tim) if I steered folks here on occasion? I'll make them swear to behave.

Sure thing. The more the merrier! This isn't a private club.

[catamount]

FWIW, the ISAF Offshore Special Regulations forbid connecting your bilge pump outlet to your cockpit drains -- the bilge pumps require their own outlet. This probably doesn't really apply to your boat in your application, but it is something to think about.