How to Value a Project Boat

cmartin · Post by **cmartin** » Thu Oct 23, 2008 4:31 pm

Hello All

I've been on the hunt for an Alberg30 off and on for a few months. I am in no hurry, but figure when the right boat comes along I'll know it.

So far I've looked at several boats and am having a hard time figuring out exactly what I want. Each has needed some work but can also be used right away or at least after some general attention.

Every used boat seems to need at least new rigging, wiring, some maintenance and some paint. I'm having a hard time finding the sweet spot of initial purchase price and needed work. I'm not looking for a show piece, just a safe boat I can weekend and maybe race on occasion.

Then, I find a basket case. The decks seem solid but the interior and motor are shot. The boat has been sitting on land for a long, long time and it shows. Does a boat like this have any value? My thinking is, if I'm going to rewire, paint and rebuild, why pay more up front?

Boats in generally good condition seem much easier to value. Do

I assume this is how boats end up sitting in a yard for years, naive dreams run into reality.

bcooke · Post by **bcooke** » Thu Oct 23, 2008 6:14 pm

My advice, biased and opinionated though it may be...

Unless you want a project boat for the sake of having a project, don't go that way. Its way more work and money than buying a boat ready to go. The real value of a project boat is the 'fun' in doing the work, and the fact that the boat is the ultimate customized boat built just to your needs and wants. If you want a project get the best boat you can for the least money. Like you said, you are going to tear it apart anyway so don't pay for something that you aren't going to keep. Don't pay much for a project boat.

Now, if you want a boat to use and enjoy, and the 'project' part is not the priority then by all means get the best boat you can afford. Anything you have to add is going to be more expensive than what you will find already installed in another used boat. Like a used car, the individual parts cost far more than the completed item. The whole is much cheaper than the individual parts. And then there is the fact that what you think it will take you time-wise will be grossly underestimated - it always is - and if it is more than you can commit too you run the strong risk of never finishing the job.

Then, I find a basket case. The decks seem solid but the interior and motor are shot. The boat has been sitting on land for a long, long time and it shows. Does a boat like this have any value?

Not much. A new interior is going to cost a bundle of both time and money. A new engine; plenty more money.

Boats in generally good condition seem much easier to value. Do
I assume this is how boats end up sitting in a yard for years, naive reams run into reality.

Yes. Exactly.

Basket cases are nearly worthless. Don't pay more than token money for them. Save the current owner the cost of another winter's storage fee and take it off their hands. Simply disposing of a boat costs a grand or more not including the labor to cut it up. Figure a thousand for winter storage and a thousand for disposal so if you take a boat off someone's hands they are getting $2000 of value from you without you even signing a check.

If we were talking boats with a particular perceived value like a Hinkley or such then 'basket case' value would be something else but since you mentioned A30's we can agree that we are talking the low end of the boat scale.

Boats are expensive. The fact that some can be bought cheaply today is because they are worn out and a far cry from what they were when they were first made. They will have their issues with outdated rigging, tired gelcoat., etc. We shouldn't kid ourselves. Just because the initial purchase price is low doesn't mean boats are affordable. There are no free rides in the boat world. A cheap boat is, well, ... you get what you pay for.

cantstopnow · Post by **cantstopnow** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:05 am

Well put.
Sailboats are an expessive proposition. Come to think of it so are my kids, but I wouldn't give either of them up.

keelbolts · Post by **keelbolts** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 8:52 am

Remember, when considering the relationship between a boat & its value, the part that demand plays. bcooke touched on in his comparison of the Ford & Jag. The beauty is that, for the most part, we here are Ford fans. The fact is that you can get an old Triton for, say, one tenth of the cost of some spiffy Beneslow not because the Beneslow is 90 percent better in any way. You can get the Triton cheaper because there are so many people who, being unable to tell appearance from substance, prefer the Beneslow. Given the choice, how many of us would choose the Beneslow over Glissando? I consider myself lucky as I seem to be drawn to things on the fringe.

Ceasar Choppy · Post by **Ceasar Choppy** » Fri Oct 24, 2008 10:00 am

If you are having trouble deciding between A30s, my suggestion would be to find the one that has the least amount of PO "upgrades." (I know this site is devoted to them, but this site at least promotes quality upgrades!). Something in "stock" condition makes it easier to do your own upgrades.

All boats-- even new-- need new rigging, wire, canvas, paint. Its all part of maintenance in an marine environment. Its just a matter of what kind of maintenance schedule you are on. The newer boats may not need that stuff for a while. The point is you will always pay for that stuff no matter what boat you buy, its just a matter of when.

cmartin · Post by **cmartin** » Sat Oct 25, 2008 12:20 am

Thanks all, great advice.

If you are having trouble deciding between A30s, my suggestion would be to find the one that has the least amount of PO "upgrades."

The more boats I see, the more I agree with this. A boat I am/was seriously considering has a modified interior I'm not sold on. Honestly, I would like to bring it back to original, or close to it. Oh, the nice new diesel needs to be re-installed too. :(

Quetzalsailor · Post by **Quetzalsailor** » Mon Oct 27, 2008 9:09 am

Been there, too. We looked at about 40 different boats before settling on our NE 38. I started out by looking at 'project boats'. Our friend and broker worked me around to the view that a well-priced and decent version of something that came with lots of 'toys' was far better than a bottom-feeding version and fewer toys. There are two curves there: the work to get the basics up to snuff and the dollars to buy the toys. Some of us really enjoy the work, or perhaps, define ourselves by the achievement, but that's a pretty hard item to quantify in dollars. Some few of us manage to find the toys for decent prices (not me!). It does not take many furlers, sails, engine, anchor winches, autopilots, etc., to make a bargain-priced boat cost out more than a reasonably-priced one.

Amen to the comment that an original version is to be desired over an 'improved' version. I spend a fair amount of time undoing a PO's work, particularly after I find a mistake; I begin to worry about the rest of it. The less of that the better. (Although, what will some future owner say about something I've been at?)

There's a nice crowd of A30s in the mid Chesapeake. Lovely.