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Wasn't sure which forum to put this.... picked this one, I am offering a "resource".
I see a lot of interest in Dutch built boats on this forum. I was born in, and spent 25 years sailing around Holland. If anyone ever needs help with the language to solve a problem involving a Dutch boat, please call on me.
Below a snap of me at the helm, and my brother in the front of my "Piraat", a Bruynzeel Plywood one design dinghy. Somewhere around 1965.
Great photo :) I've spent a grand total of two weeks in Holland and I needed a boating drool-bib the whole time. Gaaah.
I do have something that I am not able to translate from a Dutch boat brochure. It is in the section of "Spars, rigging, and sails."
The previous sentence is "Aluminium mast, giek en zaling van spruce," which I translated as "Aluminum mast; boom and spreaders of spruce." Then comes the sentence with the word I can't figure out. It reads "Gegalvaniseered stalen mik." I take that to say "Galvanized steel......something." But what is a "mik"? I can only come up with references to "loaf."
The next two sentences don't totally make sense to me either, because they seem redundant when I translate them, which can't be right: "Nikkelsilveren rail op mast en giek. Wissel op mast." I get "Nickel silver rail on mast and boom. Track on mast."
Thanks in advance for your help. If only I'd known you were available when I was working on "Stevenhak" (stem fitting) and "Klopfitting" (the flat fitting on the cockpit sole where the rudderstock comes through on its way to the tiller - what do we call this in English, anyway -- I can't think of the name).
Hmmm, some of this may be Frisian, the fourth of the West Germanic languages: German, Dutch, English and Frisian. It is spoken, and taught in school, in the Province of Friesland, which is on the East end of the afsluitdijk, the big dam that enclosed the Zuiderzee and made it the Ijsselmeer (from sea to lake) in 1932. Much, much boat building is/was done in Friesland as it has a long coast line, as well as a comprehensive in-land over water infra structure.
A "mik" is not a word I know as a noun. In Frisian it is indeed a loaf (of bread). It is also from the conjugation of the verb "mikken" as in "to aim", "I aim" is "Ik mik" but that doesn't make sense. Mik is also a name, first as well as last which is wat most of the searches return. I will ask someone I know....
A "wissel" is a "switch" as in railroad track switch. Is there a double track with a "switch?" Sometimes used to have a tri-sail bent on, ready to go.
The boat model described by the brochure is a Tripp-Lentsch 29. They were built in Vianen-on-Lek, near Amsterdam -- there's no Frisian connection that I know of (?) I guess I don't have to feel so bad that "mik" stumped me though :)
I'm not sure if there would be a tri-sail track with a gate (I only have a few patchy photos to go on), but there is a bronze track on the front of the mast with a car-with-ring for a spinnaker pole, so maybe that could be it (?)
When I was in Holland I was visiting friends in Friesland (Joure). I was there during the Skutsjeseilen, near Langveer, and we also went out daysailing on the Sneekermeer (at Terhorne) and kayaking at Eernewoude, amongst other gallivanting around. Most wonderful. If you go back, please bring me some nagelkaas* (with cumin) :D
Having a Dutch translator who knows sailing.... this is a great resource, thanks! (I'll have to dig out my technical page on how they built boats at DVL; it's in Dutch and describes layups and etc.)
Rachel
*Nagelkaas (nailed cheese) is this fabulous Frisian cheese that is studded with whole cloves ("nails") and (not always, from what I could tell) cumin seeds. You could get it with the base cheese either more or less aged. I though it was totally fantastic (with the cumin was my favorite).
Never had cheese with cloves, but I know of the one with the cumin seeds.... "pitjes kaas" YUM! I get it here at Wegmans, and you can mailorder both of them HERE!
Skutjeszeilen is awesome! Those people take no prisoners.... they even flip those things. Fortunately the water is never deep enough so they can't recover them.
I've been doing work on a Banjer 37 motorsailer lately, built near Nederhemert, but so far I haven't run across anything I couldn't figure out. They also have a good owners resource on the Google-box.
But I do remember well, while sailing on a small lake somewhere in Holland, looking DOWN at the cows as they grazed. Was a strange feeling.
Rachel, a 'Mik' is a boom crutch. A support for the boom, holding it up and out of the way when the boat is anchored or moored. Unlike a gallows frame, a crutch is stowed when boat is sailing. So it does the same as a topping lift but better, much more better.
It is indeed a Frisian word, I lived and sailed there for the first 25 years of my life.
PS: I've seen a few of these boats in person, and a few more in photographs, but never with a boom crutch (much less a galvanized one). That made it even more hard to guess what it might have been because I just couldn't think of any galvanized piece of hardware on them anywhere. This particular (1962) brochure does explain that it is for a boat show, and because there is not even a first boat made yet "this simple brochure will have to do." So perhaps the galvanized "mik" never made it onto the production boats.
Hoi Henk, hoe gaat ie? Ik heb nooit Vries geleerd, maar had wel een "Hollandse" Oma die in Noordwolde en Wolvega met pensioen ging. Heb als kind een aantal zomers op de boerderij aan de overkant gewerkt. Des ochtends om vier uur melken en zo. Niets verkeerd aan.
This is the 400th anniversary of Henry Hudson's voyage to the new world. He came over to see the river named for him. Arrived on September 9th, 1609.
Accordingly, the Dutch government is sponsering a year's worth of events in NYC. Some events of possible interest to this board are the parade of traditional Dutch ships and boats, and two Flying Dutchman regattas. They're paying for European FD as well as the other Dutch boats to be brought over. Should be entertaining. I had hoped to be in the Harbor with our Dutch-built LeComte North East 38 and to have my Dutch-built FD finished and on display. Probably will not have Q there, but still hope to get the FD there.
i have just recently bought a 1966 sagitta 30 hull #26. it was built by the royal systems shipyard..
i have some dutch documentation on this boat that would be great if translated...
Well, I just spent a week motoring (on the mark setting boat) around NY harbor participating in the NY400 celebrations. There were 20 traditional Dutch boats, some of which looked like the picture posted above, and the two replica Dutch ships, Halve Maen and Onrust. Also three Dutch navy ships, and a number of Dutch-flagged pleasure boats.
Oh, yes, there were a total of 56 Flying Dutchman sailboats racing, of which about 25 were Dutch (there were FD from 10 countrys participating: USA, GER, ITA, GBR, MX, CDN, NZL, AUS, NED, and Dutch Antilles. Extraordinarily cool experience! Pictures posted on http://www.sailfd.org/USA/ With some little searching, you should see some of the FlatBottom boats.
How coincidental that this thread should come up again right now - I was just last night attempting to translate some boat information from Dutch, and running into a few things that I could only guess at. I love reading these documents about early fiberglass boat-building :)
This first one is part of a description of how they assembled some boats at Vos boatyard (and maybe DeVries-Lentsch too; it's not completely clear). They are talking about putting in the bulkheads, which I mostly get, and then at the end are saying how one certain component doesn't really add much strength. That's the part I can't quite figure out. I think maybe an "a" is missing (on top of my weak translation skills). I'm gathering that they are talking about a little molded liner-type piece that runs from the one settee base across the sole and back up to the other settee base, but I'm not sure. (The flat, plywood sole then rests on it).
Here it is in Dutch:
Hierna werden beide helften van de romp, de spiegel en de achtersteven (aan de kiel) geassembleerd en werden de schotten van het zeilwerk het motorkamerschot, het voorschot, de wrang achterin, de motorfundatie en het mastspoor aangebracht. De hoofdschotten waren ook zeer berekend qua constructie. De beide binnenschalen waren niet zwaar geconstrueerd. Ik denk niet dat ze veel bijdragen aan de sterkte en stijfheid van de romp.
And what I have in English so far:
Then followed the two halves of the hull, the transom and the stern (the keel) were assembled and the [main?] bulkheads, the engine room bulkhead, the [anchor locker bulkhead?], the aft [sour?], the engine foundation and affixed the mast [truck? step?]. The main bulkheads were very calculated in terms of design. The two [liner pieces?] were not very heavily constructed. I do not think they contribute much to the strength and stiffness of the hull.
*****
The second thing I'm working on is where a fellow is talking about making some repairs to his Dutch-built boat. He's talking about getting blisters on the hull that show up in the exact place where there are water-logged stringers on the inside. I understand how he talks about water dripping into the boat, aft, and running down the stringers until it finds a hole in them. And then it seems he says he fixed it and they are still dry two years later; but I can't figure out the part about fixing them (and something about a hand or paw...). Does he actually describe his fix and I missed it?
(He earlier tells how the stringers are box sections of fiberglass with some kind of foam inside, which matches up with what I read earlier in the above document about their original construction.)
Here it is in Dutch: Op de romp heb ik een groot aantal osmoseblaasjes opengemaakt met een bolkopfreesje. Nadat dit gedaan is lijken er twee stroken zichtbaar op de romp waarin zich de osmose concentreert. Precies waar aan de binnekant de stringers zitten.
Deze zijn nat vanbinnen. De boosdoener lijkt lekkage op het achterdek onder de dieselinlaat. Het water dat daar binnenkomt valt op de bodem en begint langs de stringers naar voren te lopen. In een van de stringers zit een gaatje waardoor het water naar binnen kan. Aangezien de kern uit schuim bestaat heeft vermoedelijk de hele stringer zich uiteindelijk volgezogen. Bij de onderste zal ook wel iets dergelijks aan de hand zijn. Dat moet ik nog uitzoeken.
Na deze reparatie blijken de stringers na weer twee seizoenen in het water droog gebleven.
And what I have so far:
On the hull I have a large number of osmosis blisters opened with a [some kind of tool].
Once this is done I see that the blisters are concentrated in two strips along the hull in which is exactly where the stringers run inside the boat.
The stringers are wet inside. The culprit seems to be a leak leak under the aft diesel [intake through hull?]. The water that comes in there falls onto the stringers and and runs forward along them, and in one of the stringers is a hole through which water can enter. Probably the core foam of the whole stringer has become saturated. At the bottom will be something similar to the [hand? paw?] I must figure this out.
After this repair the stringers appear to still be dry two seasons later.
******
Thanks in advance for your help, Oscar :) It's fun to learn some history of early fiberglass boat-building.
Earliest fiberglass LeComte 'Medalists' were laid up by DeVries-Lentsch and the woodwork done by LeComte. (Similarly, the Alden Challenger 38s were laid up by Hallimatic in the UK and finished in several yards: Direcktor, LeComte, Molich and one more. Their structure is quite different with half round ribs in the hull and wood ribbed solid glass decks.)
The LeComte-built LeComtes were built similarly: solid 'glass hull halves (tabbed on the interior and simply butted on the exterior); on our NE38 Mk III- a closure piece forming the trailing edge of the keel (earlier versions had attached rudders); tankage, baffles, tank tops, and huge access panels are made up out of flat layups added in after the halves were joined; longitudinal flattish 'bilge stringers' are foam strips glassed in; longitudinal stiffeners for the aft overhang are hollow large half-round shapes glassed in and used for engine supply and exhaust ventilation; deck drains are half round shapes terminating below the LWL; lower chain plates (I think) are glassed into the hull; upper chain plates are glassed into large channels; maststeps varied in the boats, ours is a hollow arrangement of flat 'glass and stainless plate left hollow and closed up; deck is Airex cored and has (I fear) wood core at load points, no core at perimeter; deck is glassed to the hull, but may also be bolted (concealed by the sheer tabbing - toe rail bolts are exposed); interior woodwork is (I think) not structural, bulkheads and similar plywood panels are located by small tabbing and small bronze bolts, the tabbing is not bonded to the wood; sole beams and other minor wood components are lightly tabbed to the hull.
Earlier LeComtes had carbon steel components for support of the quadrant and chain plates; our components are stainless.
The hull has been sand blasted and barrier coated with something gooey. I have seen no sign of blistering or repairs. Some of the tabbing is resin starved and sloppy (the B team).
I've translated the few words that you were missing.
'wrang' is a support that creates stiffness like a knee. 'schotten van het zeilwerk' translates to 'bulkheads of the sails' (??) 'mastspoor' means Mast rail, and 'binnenschalen' I believe means large liner pieces.
On the hull I have a large number of osmosis blisters opened with a [dremel]
Once this is done I see that the blisters are concentrated in two strips along the hull in which is exactly where the stringers run inside the boat.
The stringers are wet inside. The culprit seems to be a leak [on the poopdeck under the diesel inlet]. The water that comes in there falls onto the stringers and and runs forward along them, and in one of the stringers is a hole through which water can enter. Probably the core foam of the whole stringer has become saturated. At the bottom will be something similar to the [Probably the same trouble with the botton one.] I must figure this out.
('aan de hand' usually means something like 'the trouble')
After this repair the stringers appear to still be dry two seasons later.
No Rachel, he does not explain how he repaired them.
Hope this helps.
And hoi Oscar,
Sorry dat ik niet metteen reageerde, zovaak kijk ik niet op het forum. En trouwens het is Fries, niet Vries...
Ik woon in Duncan, BC en onze boot ligt in Ladysmith.
Veel zeilplezier toegewenst.
Amazing how filling in just a few words brings it all together. Thanks so much. I think by "the bulkheads of the sails" perhaps they mean the main bulkhead(s). Because the shrouds more-or-less anchor there.
Well no wonder I couldn't figure out what the fellow was saying about how he repaired the stringers. All repairs should go in the blink of an eye like that: "I have a problem I must figure out. Two years later and all is well" :laugh:
Only sort of on topic, but here are some pictures of a boat in the slip next to my dinghy space in Wickford:
Dave Finnegan
builder of Spindrift 9N #521 'Wingë'
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Gresham’s Law of information: Bad information drives out good. No matter how long ago a correction for a particular error may have appeared in print or online, it never seems to catch up with the ever-widening distribution of the error.
