I am currently working on the bilge on my boat, I noticed that bilge slopes and is fiberglass til about half way then it turns into wood chip plywood all the way to below the engine mounting sled. One of the boards broke under my weight and I removed it and there is about a 12 space under it... and another chip plywood
I am in to this now and want to fix everything, Any info anyone can give would be appreciated. Any help to what I should do as well for repairs or what else i should do down in there.
Also I see there is only one fiberglassed in stringer across the bilge between the hull sides and very lightly tabbed in .. looks very weak and I would think that one need more than one, to me looking in here I would think one by the engine pan and middle and opposite end seems more probable.
I feel like I need to put three in here.. can i make them out of two 1 1/2 foam and glass them well in. Or do i need to use ply.. seems that only the fiberglass would be holding it anyway. I have read though that even closed cell foam is not really waterproof it will eventually water log?
Thank you for any help.
Any idea what is under here before i tear into it.. it appears to be light fiberglass tabbed in but it is peeling off.Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
- atomvoyager
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Re: Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
Only some of the cheaper lighter density foam boards will absorb any significant amount of water over time. You can either seal them better with fiberglass/resin as you would with plywood (but then you might as well use plywood) or use a higher quality foam like core-cell or divinycell or high density Coosa. 3/4" thick should be enough for this job. To save money I often use 3/4" ply and take great care to seal it with many coats of epoxy as well as fiberglass but for a little extra cost the coosa is more permanent and less labor and I'll use it more often going forward.
Not sure what is in your photo. If it is aft of the ballast area it could be wood, cement and some other fillers and scarp. You could drill into it and see what shavings come up and drill say a 1/4" hole up from the bottom of the keel and see if any water comes out. Unless it is easy to pull out, I'd leave it in after grinding the surfaces and sealing it off with a couple layers of fiberglass.
You can see the bilge fiberglassing and how many athwartships supports/dividers I used in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtj7tVZ ... e=emb_logo
Not sure what is in your photo. If it is aft of the ballast area it could be wood, cement and some other fillers and scarp. You could drill into it and see what shavings come up and drill say a 1/4" hole up from the bottom of the keel and see if any water comes out. Unless it is easy to pull out, I'd leave it in after grinding the surfaces and sealing it off with a couple layers of fiberglass.
You can see the bilge fiberglassing and how many athwartships supports/dividers I used in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mtj7tVZ ... e=emb_logo
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Re: Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
Thank you
I have seen your video for sure, what your looking at in the aft bilge right in front of the engine pan, after removing the first layer of ply.. actually it was chip board the kind that is large flakes of wood pressed together, lightly tabbed in. Then under that is another board of chip board again, tabbing is coming lose as well.
Th wood here is dry.. the moister meter shows it as dry. I guess I will have to tear this out and see what is under there, Have you ever been into this lower area.. ? I am sure this is the area that need good seal from water intrusion. I could just clean it and sand an re-tab it and let it go I suppose. Or clean it well with moldicide and put some ply on the bottom and tab it in.
I think i shall use some coosa, I have three sheets in my shop.. I had planed on using them for other things but as usual I changed my mind mid stream.
I was really surprised at the way this boat was built, both main bulkheads were all only tabbed on one side just as lazaret lockers were as well an not very thick tabbing either. Now I've gone an over done it. Thinking back nothing was tabbed on both sides from the chain locker to the lazaret bulkheads.
I have seen your video for sure, what your looking at in the aft bilge right in front of the engine pan, after removing the first layer of ply.. actually it was chip board the kind that is large flakes of wood pressed together, lightly tabbed in. Then under that is another board of chip board again, tabbing is coming lose as well.
Th wood here is dry.. the moister meter shows it as dry. I guess I will have to tear this out and see what is under there, Have you ever been into this lower area.. ? I am sure this is the area that need good seal from water intrusion. I could just clean it and sand an re-tab it and let it go I suppose. Or clean it well with moldicide and put some ply on the bottom and tab it in.
I think i shall use some coosa, I have three sheets in my shop.. I had planed on using them for other things but as usual I changed my mind mid stream.
I was really surprised at the way this boat was built, both main bulkheads were all only tabbed on one side just as lazaret lockers were as well an not very thick tabbing either. Now I've gone an over done it. Thinking back nothing was tabbed on both sides from the chain locker to the lazaret bulkheads.
- atomvoyager
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Re: Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
If no water drains out the bottom of keel in that area and the wood surface inside is not rotting then I don't see why you need to tear it out. On another A30 in that area I just added more fiberglass and resin to seal it in and strengthen the bond. I never felt the A30 had particularly good build quality, just like my Pearson Triton, but the design is excellent, and for the most part the build was adequate considering how long they've lasted. But the repair, strengthening, and general refit jobs list on these boats is long. Similar story for many production boats. Whitby was definitely not a high-end builder.
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Re: Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
Atom I have a question for you! After doing your integrated tank in the v locker, did you experience any hobby horsing more than before or any weight imbalance? Would you change anything if doing it over.
I was contemplating a integrated tank in the v berth but a bit different than yours. My Idea was to make a tank up the middle of the v berth longer and narrower... 10" High starting about 12 inches forward of the Main bulkhead 15" wide 4' up the center of the v berth. I took all the measurements today and it fits perfect. With the measurements I took accounting for the extra space caused by the v in the hull it would hold about 33 gallon. Being on an incline as it consumed it would keep the weight moving backward. Obviously I would build it with baffles.
I have cabinet and storage designs that would make this placement work better for my plans I have for the berth storage area.
Just curious if you experienced anything after doing yours that you would change ?
I was contemplating a integrated tank in the v berth but a bit different than yours. My Idea was to make a tank up the middle of the v berth longer and narrower... 10" High starting about 12 inches forward of the Main bulkhead 15" wide 4' up the center of the v berth. I took all the measurements today and it fits perfect. With the measurements I took accounting for the extra space caused by the v in the hull it would hold about 33 gallon. Being on an incline as it consumed it would keep the weight moving backward. Obviously I would build it with baffles.
I have cabinet and storage designs that would make this placement work better for my plans I have for the berth storage area.
Just curious if you experienced anything after doing yours that you would change ?
- atomvoyager
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Re: Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
I wouldn't necessarily change the design because of weight distribution alone although on the Triton Osprey we built the tank further aft because the owner wanted it and it does make sense if you don't mind giving up that convenient big locker aft the tank. Moving it further aft and/or making it smaller does improve any tendency to bury the bow or hobbyhorse when beating into short seas if the tank is full. Although the sailing performance difference between a full and say half full tank was just noticeable at times, I never experienced that as a significant problem. The times when I'm beating hard and the tank happens to be near full are infrequent anyway and I always have the choice not to fully fill the tank if its a concern. And it's not that bad because my tank is not fully forward under the v-berth - there is a watertight locker between it and the chain locker. For best sailing performance, yes it is better to have a smaller tank further aft. I didn't do that in my case because my priority was to have the big locker aft the tank where I can stow frequently used gear or awkward items such as my heavy sewing machine, the sextant box, bedding, etc.
I assume you mean that the bottom of the tank slopes up following the hull and that the top remains level on your proposed tank. The top has to be level to keep the inspection port not under continuous pressure. A square tank like mine means you only need three panels and one inspection port. A narrow 4' long tank will need 5 panels and at least two ports. Even so, if you worked out your gear stowage arrangement and collision bulkhead arrangement for lockers around the tank then your plan seems practical. Keep in mind that using plywood you need to be very careful to get it sealed well with fiberglass and multiple epoxy coats. Otherwise, if it's in your budget, best to use Coosa or make your own panels with Divinycell and a layer of 1708 biaxial fiberglass on both sides.
I assume you mean that the bottom of the tank slopes up following the hull and that the top remains level on your proposed tank. The top has to be level to keep the inspection port not under continuous pressure. A square tank like mine means you only need three panels and one inspection port. A narrow 4' long tank will need 5 panels and at least two ports. Even so, if you worked out your gear stowage arrangement and collision bulkhead arrangement for lockers around the tank then your plan seems practical. Keep in mind that using plywood you need to be very careful to get it sealed well with fiberglass and multiple epoxy coats. Otherwise, if it's in your budget, best to use Coosa or make your own panels with Divinycell and a layer of 1708 biaxial fiberglass on both sides.
Re: Alberg 30 Bilge Repair Help
I also just about finished my "bilge repair". Underneath all that is just the ballast embedded in some type of cement. I cut out all of the fake floor including the remainder of the old chipped ballast encapsulation, scrubbed my bilge for 4 hrs removing all oil residues, let it dry from any wetness, removed all rust from ballast with angle grinder, put on a layer of thickened epoxy, proceeded the lay up 3 to 4 layers of cloth, and added new bulkheads. Hope that helps.