Keel Void and Barrier Coat

[Bill Vanguard 281]

Hello folks - I poked a few holes around my ballast and into the keel void on my Vanguard. Drained lots o water. Found a lot of mung around the ballast soaked balsa I believe and some wonderful foam smells delicious.

Anyway I plan to barrier coat the bottom in the spring and want opinions on wether or not I need to excavate the junk out arount the ballast or just seal her up and barrier coat away.

Thanks Bill

[Rachel]

One thing in your favor is that I think all of the Vanguards had a lead ballast pig. That is, you don't have a rusting/swelling metal issue in the mix.

R.

PS I bet you'll get good advice either way, but photos always grease the skids around here :-)

[westsail42]

Hello folks - I poked a few holes around my ballast and into the keel void on my Vanguard. Drained lots o water. Found a lot of mung around the ballast soaked balsa I believe and some wonderful foam smells delicious.

Anyway I plan to barrier coat the bottom in the spring and want opinions on wether or not I need to excavate the junk out arount the ballast or just seal her up and barrier coat away.

Thanks Bill

We just finished barrier coating our balsa cored 28 footer. It had a gelcoat peel and sat on the hard drying out for a year. There were some small areas where the balsa core was damp (not dripping or rotting, just damp). It was still damp after a year (though less damp than originally).

Local yard guys said, "if it isnt saturated with water or black with rot, dont bother, go ahead and apply the barrier coat, otherwise it should be cut out and replaced."

So, we left it in place.

[bcooke]

I think excavating around the ballast would be a BIG job and I am not sure at all that it would be worth it. Some things are just better off left alone...

Of course if you barrier coat then you are going to be sealing the water in as much as you are keeping water out. Not sure how that works out.

-Britton

[Ceasar Choppy]

We just finished barrier coating our balsa cored 28 footer. It had a gelcoat peel and sat on the hard drying out for a year. There were some small areas where the balsa core was damp (not dripping or rotting, just damp). It was still damp after a year (though less damp than originally).

I think Bill is wondering about the scraps of balsa etc that were left in the keel void when the lead was installed in his ecapsulated ballast keel.

Bill, I think the question is whether any moisture in that cavity is gonna cause problems down the road. It certainly depends on how much and if more water will get in from the same source.

I've seen leaks come in from holes or cracks in the bilge area that lead to the keel cavity and you might want to check for anything there. Its certainly possible that the moisture got in through from the outside, but I would doubt that unless you know for sure.

I had a similar problem on a previous boat that I was able to solve, at least I think so. I opened up the cavity a little, sucked out all the goo with a shop vac, and injected expanding polyeurethane foam. If water still gets in there, the foam will not absorb it like the balsa scraps Pearson used.

Another Renegade owner really went to town on his... I think he was trying to prevent more blisters being caused from water inside the keel. See what he did here: http://www.renegade27.org/keelrepair.htm

[radicalcy]

My Columbia Sabre has an encapsulated keel, with a huge, deep bilge. She sat on a mooring for 8 years, in heat, and in ice , with the bilge full to overflowing. There were no moisture issues, and not a single blister, either internal or external. Now, I know that we're talking different boats here, but I believe that the hull thickness and heavy layup schedules on our older boats have prevented many of the problems of saturation that have plagued many newer boats. I personally wouldn't worry about removing the wet material,but if it bothers you, it would be easy enough to cut an access hole and hose the mess out. Resealing would be just as easy.
Larry Wilson
1965 Columbia Sabre #51 "Wild Swan"

[jollyboat]

[quote=" I poked a few holes around my ballast and into the keel void on my Vanguard. Drained lots o water. Found a lot of mung around the ballast soaked balsa I believe and some wonderful foam smells delicious.

Bill - Would it be possible to take a few pictures of what it is that you are describing. This would help a lot in possibly offering additional suggestions.

[Ceasar Choppy]

My Columbia Sabre has an encapsulated keel, with a huge, deep bilge. She sat on a mooring for 8 years, in heat, and in ice , with the bilge full to overflowing. There were no moisture issues, and not a single blister, either internal or external. Now, I know that we're talking different boats here, but I believe that the hull thickness and heavy layup schedules on our older boats have prevented many of the problems of saturation that have plagued many newer boats. I personally wouldn't worry about removing the wet material,but if it bothers you, it would be easy enough to cut an access hole and hose the mess out. Resealing would be just as easy.
Larry Wilson
1965 Columbia Sabre #51 "Wild Swan"

IMO this is a common problem... I've seen it on many plastic classics. Just because your boat is dry doesn't mean someone else's isn't. It has nothing necessarily to do with thickness and layup schedules etc, and this doesn't affect newer boats because newer boats have bolt-on keels. All it takes is a small imperfection in the bilge for water to make its way into the keel cavity.

While this is not a serious issue in that it will not sink the boat, it is nevertheless a problem if you are trying to avoid blisters because there is water on both the inside and outside.

The reason there is balsa core in this cavity is because it was scrap material used to bed the lead. Balsa, sawdust, foam, whatever. It is not structural, like it is in the deck.