Capable Truckers?

[catamount]

Thinking ahead to the possibility of having a decent sized boat (LOA 34', Beam 11'3", Draft 6'3" Displacement ~11,000 lbs) trucked inland to my home in Keene, NH, next year in order to better overhaul her, my driveway presents the probable crux move. It's about 250 long, from the roadway to the parking area, with an average grade of 17% (25% at it's steepest -- yep, that's 1 foot in 4). Once you get up, we've got a big level area (say about 50' wide by 300' long), so plenty of room to park a boat but maybe not enough to turn the rig around -- or is it?

My brother, who is a heavy equipment operator and regularly drives big rigs isn't so sure. When he brought an excavator down here to do a job for us years ago, he unloaded the machine at the bottom, and then backed the empty trailer (behind a big 10-wheel dump truck) up the driveway.

With a boat, my thought is to have the trucker drive up, unload the boat, pull ahead (plenty of room to do that), and then back the trailer around the boat and back down the driveway to the road. When they come to take her back to water, I envision that they would drive up, pull around in front of the boat, back under it to load it, and then back the boat down the driveway (sort of like a long, steep launching ramp.... ).

Any of you folks who've had experience moving boats around want to comment?

Thanks,

[Jason K]

My boat stays in the water year round, so I don't have experience towing something the size of a midsize sailboat. However, I have towed a lot of powerboats up to nearly that size. I've gotten them into some pretty tight places. Forgive my ignorance, but why can't he back in, unload the boat and drive out straight?

[catamount]

why can't he back in, unload the boat and drive out straight?

Maybe he can. It's just that he would have to back his loaded trailer up a very steep driveway that isn't exactly straight. My brother did it with the excavator trailer, but it had no load on it. How low a reverse gear do the tractor trucks used to haul boats have? Would a lower gear be available going forward? I used to have to drop into 4X4 low range in my old 3-liter pickup to tow our ~1500 lb San Juan 21 up the driveway (no problem with my new more powerful mini-van, though).

BTW, there is enough room to swing around with this rig:

~20'-long tow vehicle + ~28'-long trailer with boat -- yeah, I've got a long tongue on the trailer for that SJ21, and yeah, that's a Laser inverted over the foredeck of the SJ21.

[Jason K]

The key here is momentum. It seems if he can keep his speed up, he should be able to make it up the grade. Is there enough room to accelelerate to, say, 45 mph? :)

[Jason K]

Seriously, I'd be shocked if he couldn't back up that driveway, even in reverse. Those trucks are probably almost as powerful as that minivan, and they're geared for such challenges. I had a Range Rover that would haul an old, heavy powerboat out of some steep, slick boat ramps at idle in low gear. Even that truck had two reverse gears (high and low).

I wouldn't worry about it. Of course, your brother knows a whole lot more about rigs than I do, I'm sure.

Another thought, is there enough room for him to drive straight up the driveway, set the boat, and then move forward far enough to clear your boat and position himself to reverse back down the driveway?

[Tim]

The only answer to this can come from your potential hauler. You need to have them come out to the site in advance and have them evaluate it from their perspective. Some haulers are more game than others. It may also affect their choice of equipment for the job. I wouldn't think a full-sized Brownell trailer (probably 60' in length, plus the tractor) would be the best choice here, but a smaller trailer might work fine.

I visited a Triton in NH once a few years ago, and she was located up a similar sort of driveway--steep and wind-y, with little room at the top. It was clear the truck had entered forward and driven up the drive, then backed the boat into its storage location, pulled straight out, and backed down the driveway. Removing the boat was the opposite.

Backing a loaded truck all the way up the driveway might be possible, depending on the truck and the driveway surface. Traction can be a possible issue here. This doesn't mean it's impossible--but trucks are made for hauling heavy loads in a forward direction, not reverse; all things are not equal in both directions. Again: your hauler will know the answer here.

[Figment]

The capability of the truck to back up the hill won't be a problem. The DRIVER'S capability, on the other hand....

Boat-hauling drivers are better than most, but still I've seen a bunch who couldn't back a trailer around a corner to save their lives.
Tim's right... Narrow your field to two haulers and then have them both visit the delivery site.

[catamount]

As you may recall from the start of this thread, my driveway is rather steep. It's about 250 feet long, with an average grade of 17%. At it's steepest, it is 25% -- or one foot in four! There's a little bit of a curve to it, and the transitions from flat to hill at both bottom and top are fairly rapid. We were quite concerned about whether we'ld be able to get the boat up the hill. In fact, we made arrangements with a neighbor who's lot was much more accessible to park the boat there, at least temporarily, if getting up our driveway was impossible. I had e-mailed pictures of my driveway to a couple truckers. Ron Wiswell of Marblehead Trading Company in Marblehead, Mass,. said he was willing to give it a try. As it turns out, Ron had raced on my very boat, as bowman, under her first two owners!

On Wednesday morning, the mast was unstepped, disassembled, and stored in Marblehead Trading's shed, and the boat was craned out, pressure washed, and loaded onto a hydraulic trailer, strapped down and ready to go by 11:00. Unfortunately, the oversize permit didn't come in from the New Hampshire DOT until 14:30 that afternoon -- too late to get under way that day.



Ron got underway Thursday morning after the curfew on Rte. 128, and arrived in Keene at about 11:40. He made several attempts at trying to back the boat up the hill, but simply couldn't get traction and was burning quite a bit of rubber.



He parked the boat at the bottom, and he walked up to check out what things looked like at the top. We weren't sure there would be room for him to turn his rig around in our yard. I suggested that if he drove up forwards, there would be room to unload the boat, pull ahead and then back the empty trailer down. Unfortunatley, this would present a problem when he came to take the boat back to the water, as he wasn't comfortable backing the loaded trailer down the hill. We wondered whether he could load the boat onto the trailer stern first. Nope. So I suggested that if he got the boat up the hill, I could get a crane to come and spin it around before he came back to take it to the water.

We walked back down and Ron drove his truck down to the end of our street to turn around and make an attempt on the driveway going up forwards. He made it to the top on his second try (I should have told him that in my experience you have to stop and shift into your lowest gear before you head up the hill; downshifting part way up just doesn't work).



Once at the top, he pulled out onto the lawn, and proceeded to attempt to turn the rig around. It was a 5-point turn, but he made it!



"Where do you want it?" -- "Right there, that's perfect!"



My wife is very happy to have GREYHAWK in our yard, and not parked in some distant spot, as now I'll be spending all my time at home rather than away. Here is the view from the 2nd floor of our house. You can see the truck and trailer tire tracks running across the lawn.



On to Phase 2 of the Project!

Regards,

[Rachel]

Cool! I love that the driver (and you) didn't give up right away :-)

Thanks for the update - I like finding out what happens later on.

--- Rachel

[CharlieJ]

HEY- A San Juan 21 Mark I - Haven't seen one of those in years. Had one in Florida back in 1973- 1975.

[Tim]

Good thing it's been nice and dry lately. Imagine if your yard had been wet and saturated.

The good drivers always make it look easy, even when facing defeat head on. Glad to see that the boat is safe and sound!

So when did I miss the fact that tbe boat somehow got from Boothbay to Marblehead?

[Mark.Wilme]

Catamount

How do you get on with having the boat stands on grass ? We are thinking of buying a newer boat and bringing her home for the winter (just emailed Marblehead for a quote), but I'd need 2 of the 7 stands to be on grass. Is it just plywood squares or have you done something more substantial ?

Mark

[catamount]

Just plywood squares under each leg of the stands (8 to 12 inches square). The place where the boat is parked is pretty solid, as we've had numerous loaded trucks (e.g. 2 or 3 cords of green firewood) drive on that area over the years...

[catamount]

So back at the end of May, Ron the trucker came back to take Greyhawk back to the water. He drove up the driveway, out into the field, turned his rig around, drove back out around the boatshed, and then backed his trailer under the boat.





We drove off down the driveway going forwards. He said it was a bit tricky, because all the air was going to keeping the trailer raised up as high as it could go for clearance, and thus he had no brakes on the trailer. But he made it; the boat was launched, and we had a pretty good season of sailing.

Yesterday, 10/27, the boat was hauled out in Marblehead and put on the trailer. Ron arrived at about 8:45 this morning. It had drizzled just a bit earlier in the morning, so everything was wet, but at least is wasn't raining hard.

Here's some Quicktime video I shot in "movie mode" with my digital camera (my wife took more video with our regular video camera, which we have yet to digitize).

http://sailing.thorpeallen.net/Greyhawk ... livery.mov

It show's him trying to back up the driveway (no go), turning around at the end of my street and trying to make the turn going up the hill forward, going up the hill (success!), and then heading out onto our lawn around the boat tent to turn around. Where the video stops, he's stuck, sinking into the mud.

We got a tow truck to come up and give him a twitch to help get him back out of there. Then he drove into the tent going forward, unloaded the boat, drove out the other side, and then backed the empty trailer back around the tent and down the driveway.

Let's hope it's dry when he next comes to take the boat back to the water. He'll have to drive around the boat tent, back in to pick up the boat, and then turn the rig around on the lawn in order to drive down the driveway....

Maybe it's time for us to move to (a) someplace closer to the water; and (b) someplace easier to get boats in and out of! (It is something that I think about whenever I pass a house with a for-sale sign!)

In the meantime, let me just put in another plug for Ron Wiswell, Marblehead Trading Company, trucking@marbleheadtrading.com
1-800-600-9382, http://www.marbleheadtrading.com/main.html

Thanks Ron!

Tim A.

[catamount]

OK, here's the full video (about 8 minutes) with the tow truck, etc...

http://sailing.thorpeallen.net/Greyhawk ... ivery2.mov

[Triton 185]

Hi Tim,

Thanks for the video. Makes me think of some boat transport ventures I have had to endure through! Keep fingers crossed and let people do their jobs....most of the time

[Tim]

You have a very understanding trucker.

I was kind of hoping for a bigger tow truck, though.

[catamount]

You have a very understanding trucker.

Yes, Ron is just very persevering. I think the fact that he used to race on my boat back in his youth helps a bit. The two times he's been to my house before (the first delivery, and then pickup this spring), he was able to turn his rig around in our field. But not this time!

I was kind of hoping for a bigger tow truck, though.

Yeah, I called one place (Fran's) right around the corner from my house, because I thought I remembered that they had a BIG tow truck, but they gave me another number to call, which put me in touch with J&B. I told him that I had a tractor-trailer truck stuck in my yard, and he said that since he was going out anyway he'ld stop by to see what he could do. Fortunately, the car carrier did the trick!

J&B told me that he had bought all of Fran's trucks, and that the big truck was costing him $25K per year to run, but was only generating $20K of revenue...

[catamount]

So Ron Wiswell of Marblehead Trading Company came on Thursday June 25 to haul GREYHAWK back to Marblehead for launching. Of course, last fall when he got stuck in our yard, he left the boat with the bow pointing away from the driveway. We monitored the weather all through June, trying to assess how wet the lawn might be when the truck came and whether he would be able to turn the rig around or not. I contacted the local Crane Service and arranged to have them come out to pick the boat up and spin it around so it would be pointing bow out, but in talking to Ron in advance of his coming, he said that although that would be nice, he didn't think it would be necessary or worth the cost ($600). So I cancelled the crane.

When Ron finally showed up, he said he was thinking about backing his empty trailer up the driveway and loading the boat on backwards. I told him that despite the rain we had had, the ants were bringing up dry sand and he ought to check it out before committing to any one course of action. So he drove up forwards, pulled ahead of the boat, backed under it and loaded the boat onto the trailer facing the right way, but then decided that it was too risky (potential for getting stuck) to try to turn the rig around on the lawn and so would attempt to back the boat down the driveway! Remember this driveway is over 250 feet long, is a bit serpentine, and has an average gradient of 17%!

In the end he made it! When it was done, Ron said "it was easy!" (implication being easier than he thought it would be!).

Anyway the boat is back in the water now, and I do not anticipate that we'll ever be bringing her back to Keene in the future... pheww!

Tim A.

[One Way David]

This is a neat story. I'm kinda interested from the angle of the tow truck. Looking at the pictures it looke like a 4wd Dodge 3500 would have been my choice. The reason is that in 4wd, that cummins engine puts 1200 lbs of weight on the front wheels and I'll bet it would back that rig up the hill. A boat that size would probably require a goose neck trailer, hence putting weight over the rear wheels. I really think that would solve tha traction issue. But I'm posing a rhetorical question ssince you don't plan on doing this again. Dave