Comprehensive spar thread

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ghostwriter247
Master Varnisher
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Comprehensive spar thread

Post by ghostwriter247 »

So it looks like at the very least im looking at new spreaders and boom, so given the amount of work involved and the fact i have to buy a new boom, i thought id solicit opinions of the best rig and or boom size as well as any goodies people would put on to update the rig on my A35. Alot of my questions on winches and sheet and halyard arrangements are answered by reading on sailnet articles and here, but the nuts and bolts of understanding Booms and masts seem to be harder to find. I've looked on harkens site and there catalog which has some wonderful information, but its unclear how it relates to older boats.

I saw the post on jdi (?) spreaders and will prolly have them made there. I went to there website and they look like a good resource. Im betting on the sails needing to be replaced so there really isnt any upside to keeping the same rig as far as the main is concern

Initially, i was thinking about replacing the boom and spreaders and adding a bowsprit (only to use for an A spinnaker, rather than a true cutter rig) and possibly switching over to a low aspect rig

so in a perfect world, what options would you put on the boom to update a more modern rig?

Bear in mind I really dont know much about the details, so i actually dont understand terms like club footed or loose footed on sails. I searched through questions and answers but didnt find a comprehensive thread on updated spars so I figured this might do for all us newbies to use as a resource.

My initial thoughts are to have jdi Build another 15 foot boom, with a sail track, which if i understand correctly will also involve a new gooseneck as well to replace the roller reefing setup. I would also like to add an outhaul, a one or two line reefing system that can be used from the cockpit, as well as a preventer or a boom vang. I think you'll only see a boom drop a guy once before you get one of these! As well, I was gonna stick with end boom sheeting. I was going to stay away from lazy jacks for now, but think about adding it later if i head for the coast at some point.

What are the merits of an internal vs external reefing arrangement? I was leaning heavily towards external on everything just for ease of maintenance and inspection, especially if something broke in a blow. What exaclty is the difference between a 1 versus 2 line reefing system? If i understand these correctly, you can simply head up a bit and reef from the cockpit right?

I looked at the garhuaer catalog, but dont know the proper ratios. Can somebody educate me on an easy reef system, and a line type vang, and end boom sheeting as far as the working ratios and what would be appropriate for my size boat. Its a Little unclear once you figure in the difference in modern vs older rig types with sail sizes being different. They dont really qualify as to whether this is a low or high aspect mainsail or mid versus end boom sheeting and if they do its usually mid boom and low aspect.

Would there be an advantage to lowering and or putting the boom higher and shortening the boom.

From reading on the B29 resto site I kind of understand what it does physics wise, and he certainly makes a good argument for it, but how would an older boat match up with a more modern Low aspect rig?

Greg nestor identifies this as tender to 25 to 30 degrees heel, but if that was reduced down to 20 or so while maintaining the drive with better windward ability that would be good.

ANy advice and or discussions of "in a perfect world" would be appreciated. Links are good too if this has been discussed elswehere.

Thanks
Shoalcove
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Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by Shoalcove »

There is a lot of info on the Harken.com site that will help on those questions. A sailmaker would also be a good resource.
Good luck
7 1/2' Nutshell Pram
Spindrift 11N
Perry designed CheoyLee35
ghostwriter247
Master Varnisher
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Joined: Wed Nov 12, 2008 3:14 pm
Boat Name: The Celtic Cross
Boat Type: 67 bristol 27
Location: Iowa

Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by ghostwriter247 »

Thanks. I read the harken material which is great, and jsi got back with me and should be a wonderful resource. Luckily enough though. My nearest Beta marine dealer raced an ericson thirty five which was a alberg knockoff (same hull different deck) whose factory sail plan is much like what i plan with the sprit assymetric combo in the chi mac races back in the day.

ericson apparently built this hull with a light air rig that was 3 foot taller mast and an 18 inch bowsprit masthead rig that was very successfull. While i cant add 3 foot to the mast atleast its a start on the bowsprit.

Josh
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Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by Stubrow »

I heard the story about Ericson stealing the A35 molds, but I hadn't heard about adding the bowsprit.
If it were me, I'd leave all the basic rig dimensions the same as the original design.
If you have to buy a new boom, and it's not too expensive, get one with the the original 'E' dimension and a spar maker should be able to make one that mates to whatever kind of hardware you alread have on the mast. A complete package should include 3 shieves at the clew, which will accomodate 3 lines run internally to 3 others at the goosneck. This way you can run your outhaul, as well as 2 reefing lines led down to somwhere around the mast partners. If you install some clutches, you will be able to adjust all of these independently with the winches you already have. As long as your mainsaill has the reef patches, and points, reefing should be pretty straitforward and you won't need 'jiffy reefing' etc.
I have nothing against Harken, but these days they really cater more to a really 'high end' segment of the market.
Although the A35 is not exactly a light air flyer, my feeling is that you will have little to nothing to gain in performance OR ease of handleing by altering either the 'J' or 'E' dimentions.
ghostwriter247 wrote:So it looks like at the very least im looking at new spreaders and boom, so given the amount of work involved and the fact i have to buy a new boom, i thought id solicit opinions of the best rig and or boom size as well as any goodies people would put on to update the rig on my A35. Alot of my questions on winches and sheet and halyard arrangements are answered by reading on sailnet articles and here, but the nuts and bolts of understanding Booms and masts seem to be harder to find. I've looked on harkens site and there catalog which has some wonderful information, but its unclear how it relates to older boats.

I saw the post on jdi (?) spreaders and will prolly have them made there. I went to there website and they look like a good resource. Im betting on the sails needing to be replaced so there really isnt any upside to keeping the same rig as far as the main is concern

Initially, i was thinking about replacing the boom and spreaders and adding a bowsprit (only to use for an A spinnaker, rather than a true cutter rig) and possibly switching over to a low aspect rig

so in a perfect world, what options would you put on the boom to update a more modern rig?

Bear in mind I really dont know much about the details, so i actually dont understand terms like club footed or loose footed on sails. I searched through questions and answers but didnt find a comprehensive thread on updated spars so I figured this might do for all us newbies to use as a resource.

My initial thoughts are to have jdi Build another 15 foot boom, with a sail track, which if i understand correctly will also involve a new gooseneck as well to replace the roller reefing setup. I would also like to add an outhaul, a one or two line reefing system that can be used from the cockpit, as well as a preventer or a boom vang. I think you'll only see a boom drop a guy once before you get one of these! As well, I was gonna stick with end boom sheeting. I was going to stay away from lazy jacks for now, but think about adding it later if i head for the coast at some point.

What are the merits of an internal vs external reefing arrangement? I was leaning heavily towards external on everything just for ease of maintenance and inspection, especially if something broke in a blow. What exaclty is the difference between a 1 versus 2 line reefing system? If i understand these correctly, you can simply head up a bit and reef from the cockpit right?

I looked at the garhuaer catalog, but dont know the proper ratios. Can somebody educate me on an easy reef system, and a line type vang, and end boom sheeting as far as the working ratios and what would be appropriate for my size boat. Its a Little unclear once you figure in the difference in modern vs older rig types with sail sizes being different. They dont really qualify as to whether this is a low or high aspect mainsail or mid versus end boom sheeting and if they do its usually mid boom and low aspect.

Would there be an advantage to lowering and or putting the boom higher and shortening the boom.

From reading on the B29 resto site I kind of understand what it does physics wise, and he certainly makes a good argument for it, but how would an older boat match up with a more modern Low aspect rig?

Greg nestor identifies this as tender to 25 to 30 degrees heel, but if that was reduced down to 20 or so while maintaining the drive with better windward ability that would be good.

ANy advice and or discussions of "in a perfect world" would be appreciated. Links are good too if this has been discussed elswehere.

Thanks
Randy Browning
Norwalk, CT USA
http://sailboatdata.com
mitiempo
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Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by mitiempo »

Here's a link to Pineapple Sails in California. They have several articles on their site that explain reefing quite well - why 2 line is better than single line reefing etc.
http://www.sailmaker.com/articles/index.htm
Brian
ghostwriter247
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Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by ghostwriter247 »

Thanks for the info guys. I definitely spend some time reading there.
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Chris Campbell
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Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by Chris Campbell »

Brian wrote:Here's a link to Pineapple Sails in California. They have several articles on their site that explain reefing quite well - why 2 line is better than single line reefing etc.
http://www.sailmaker.com/articles/index.htm
What a great site! I've just read their blurb on full vs. conventional battens (and will move on to other articles) and it's definitely the most complete yet concise treatment of it I've come across.

Thanks!
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Re: Comprehensive spar thread

Post by Bluenose »

Chris Campbell wrote:
Brian wrote:Here's a link to Pineapple Sails in California. They have several articles on their site that explain reefing quite well - why 2 line is better than single line reefing etc.
http://www.sailmaker.com/articles/index.htm
What a great site! I've just read their blurb on full vs. conventional battens (and will move on to other articles) and it's definitely the most complete yet concise treatment of it I've come across.

Thanks!
I had the same thought as I was reading that article. I also learn a thing or two reading their article on reefing.
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