How not to navigate a reef
- Bluenose
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How not to navigate a reef
I certainly won't repost the entire event but on Monday I ran Bolero up on the reef off Yellow Island in the San Juan's.
It was a feat of immense stupidity. All in all we got off easy, I guess. But I manage a nice first ding in Tim's gorgeous paint job. Anyway more info than anyone would want on the blog if interested.
Initial Post
Log Post of Grounding
Bolero Damage Report
It was a feat of immense stupidity. All in all we got off easy, I guess. But I manage a nice first ding in Tim's gorgeous paint job. Anyway more info than anyone would want on the blog if interested.
Initial Post
Log Post of Grounding
Bolero Damage Report
Last edited by Bluenose on Tue Jun 09, 2009 8:07 am, edited 2 times in total.
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Those that have and those that will. I have. The only way to avoid it is to stay home. Nevertheless I feel your pain, both the physical pain to the boat and the damage to your Captains ego. You're a brave man to come here and 'fess up. But hopefully like myself, we will all admit to having done same, or worse, and provide words of comfort. Your moments of Zen and introspection will come when you're sanding and filling. Meanwhile it will be a week or two of purgatory as you walk up and SEE it, every time you approach the boat.I won't try to describe the sound of our brand new boat running up onto <insert your favorite underwater hazard>. You either know or you don't, hopefully the latter.
Hey, no one got hurt and you're still sailing. It could be worse. Bet you'll be more respectful of rocks in the future.
Out there, alone, there is only truth.
Re: How not to navigate a reef
Yeow.
But you know what they say... if you haven't gone aground, you haven't gone anywhere.
I've been on the water more hours than most people will ever do in 3 lifetimes but even then, I still hit rocks. In retrospect, I felt magnificent and invincible before each grounding. So everytime I feel like I'm on the top of the world, I try to get more cautious.
Regarding GPS, if the GPS says shallow water or rocks, give it a healthy distance! GPS ain't really that exact. Not by a long shot. In my home waters, the GPS are waayyy off, like 200 feet wrong. Sometimes more.
- Case
But you know what they say... if you haven't gone aground, you haven't gone anywhere.
I've been on the water more hours than most people will ever do in 3 lifetimes but even then, I still hit rocks. In retrospect, I felt magnificent and invincible before each grounding. So everytime I feel like I'm on the top of the world, I try to get more cautious.
Regarding GPS, if the GPS says shallow water or rocks, give it a healthy distance! GPS ain't really that exact. Not by a long shot. In my home waters, the GPS are waayyy off, like 200 feet wrong. Sometimes more.
- Case
- Chris Campbell
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Oh! I feel for you! I too have been there - but I've never had such a beautiful, completely unmarred boat to do it in. I have experienced the first scratch in a new car, though, and can try to put two and two together. Ouch!
Good for you for sharing the whole experience with us through your blog - that takes courage and determination to be up front. I'm not sure I could have been as forthright as you have been. Good on you.
And Bolero, while scarred, is still Bolero and will serve you and please you as before. As all of us who participate in this forum know, our classic plastics can be repaired!
On another note - and I'm not sure that this would have helped you, but I'll mention it - I once got my Abbott 22 out of a similar predicament (hard aground on rock on a falling tide) by putting a sling at the end of a halyard and swinging myself out over the water to pull the mast down and heel the boat, lifting the keel off of the bottom in the process. She banged and shuddered a bit in the process, but did eventually float free. My butt was bruised from bouncing vigorously in a rope loop, but it worked. Another arrow for your quiver, should something like this ever befall you again. I think there is a corollary to Murphy's Law which more or less states that if you're not going to be too bothered by it it won't happen, isn't that right?
I'm glad you're fine, and that Bolero essentially is, too. Keep plying us with pictures of you and Laura enjoying her!
Fair Winds,
Chris
Good for you for sharing the whole experience with us through your blog - that takes courage and determination to be up front. I'm not sure I could have been as forthright as you have been. Good on you.
And Bolero, while scarred, is still Bolero and will serve you and please you as before. As all of us who participate in this forum know, our classic plastics can be repaired!
On another note - and I'm not sure that this would have helped you, but I'll mention it - I once got my Abbott 22 out of a similar predicament (hard aground on rock on a falling tide) by putting a sling at the end of a halyard and swinging myself out over the water to pull the mast down and heel the boat, lifting the keel off of the bottom in the process. She banged and shuddered a bit in the process, but did eventually float free. My butt was bruised from bouncing vigorously in a rope loop, but it worked. Another arrow for your quiver, should something like this ever befall you again. I think there is a corollary to Murphy's Law which more or less states that if you're not going to be too bothered by it it won't happen, isn't that right?
I'm glad you're fine, and that Bolero essentially is, too. Keep plying us with pictures of you and Laura enjoying her!
Fair Winds,
Chris
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
I bet those oars came in mighty handy! And I bet technique was the last thing on our mind. Thank goodness it was just a ding.
S/V BALANCE
Westsail32
Westsail32
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
So sorry to hear of it!! Looks like a tough old bird though!!
Thank God for Chesapeake mud.....not sure what I'd do with ROCKS everywhere!
Thank God for Chesapeake mud.....not sure what I'd do with ROCKS everywhere!
Ric Bergstrom
http://andiamoadventures.blogspot.com/
Archived old blog:
http://andiamo35.blogspot.com/
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http://andiamoadventures.blogspot.com/
Archived old blog:
http://andiamo35.blogspot.com/
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Be a lot more careful would be my guess.Ric in Richmond wrote:.....not sure what I'd do with ROCKS everywhere!
Cheers
Dennis
Luders 33 "Paper Moon" Hull No 16
Life is too short to own an ugly boat.
Dennis
Luders 33 "Paper Moon" Hull No 16
Life is too short to own an ugly boat.
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Don't visit eastern Long Island Sound.Ric in Richmond wrote:
Thank God for Chesapeake mud.....not sure what I'd do with ROCKS everywhere!
Dave Finnegan
builder of Spindrift 9N #521 'Wingë'
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builder of Spindrift 9N #521 'Wingë'
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Gresham’s Law of information: Bad information drives out good. No matter how long ago a correction for a particular error may have appeared in print or online, it never seems to catch up with the ever-widening distribution of the error.
- Bluenose
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Thanks everyone for the encouraging words and the good advice. Little by little Laura and I are getting to the place were the advice and encouragement actually gets to get heard. Many things will be changing and our the slow crossing off of our outfitting list will be greatly accelerated.
But this brings up a question I would love to hear some thoughts on (maybe it needs a new thread). How do you all actually use your GPS.
The navigational width of our home bay is approximately 200 ft
And the width of one of the passes, Pole Pass, we took in our fateful Shaw rounding is about 150 ft.
So if I assume that GPS is off by maybe 200 ft then it seem that one should never use GPS to help navigate small channels such as these. So how would you approach these channels? The paper chart is an eye test with Pole Pass less than a quarter of an inch wide and the Fisherman Bay entrance is completely covered by the channel marker symbol. Should one just avoid these tight passes and find safer destinations and routes?
Bill
I guess if it weren't for the rocks, there would be no here there.Ric in Richmond wrote:So sorry to hear of it!! Looks like a tough old bird though!!
Thank God for Chesapeake mud.....not sure what I'd do with ROCKS everywhere!
Thanks, Chris. I quite like this idea. I didn't think about it at the time and I have a climbing harness that I purchased to use if / when I need to go up the mast on Bolero (used once already). One of the things Laura and I have been dong this year is "forcing" ourselves to performing sailboat handling drills rather than figure things out when we need to. We have added running aground to our list of drills. So one nice quiet day in the near future we are going to "practice" running aground at low tide in our shallow mud bay. Then we are going to pull our "arrows" out and practice getting off. Your idea is on the list. Thanks again.Chris Campbell wrote:On another note - and I'm not sure that this would have helped you, but I'll mention it - I once got my Abbott 22 out of a similar predicament (hard aground on rock on a falling tide) by putting a sling at the end of a halyard and swinging myself out over the water to pull the mast down and heel the boat, lifting the keel off of the bottom in the process. She banged and shuddered a bit in the process, but did eventually float free. My butt was bruised from bouncing vigorously in a rope loop, but it worked. Another arrow for your quiver, should something like this ever befall you again. I think there is a corollary to Murphy's Law which more or less states that if you're not going to be too bothered by it it won't happen, isn't that right?Chris
Good advice all around, thanks. Unfortunately I can't blame GPS accuracy for this as my judgment was the primary fault.Case wrote:Yeow.
But you know what they say... if you haven't gone aground, you haven't gone anywhere.
I've been on the water more hours than most people will ever do in 3 lifetimes but even then, I still hit rocks. In retrospect, I felt magnificent and invincible before each grounding. So everytime I feel like I'm on the top of the world, I try to get more cautious.
Regarding GPS, if the GPS says shallow water or rocks, give it a healthy distance! GPS ain't really that exact. Not by a long shot. In my home waters, the GPS are waayyy off, like 200 feet wrong. Sometimes more.
- Case
But this brings up a question I would love to hear some thoughts on (maybe it needs a new thread). How do you all actually use your GPS.
The navigational width of our home bay is approximately 200 ft
And the width of one of the passes, Pole Pass, we took in our fateful Shaw rounding is about 150 ft.
So if I assume that GPS is off by maybe 200 ft then it seem that one should never use GPS to help navigate small channels such as these. So how would you approach these channels? The paper chart is an eye test with Pole Pass less than a quarter of an inch wide and the Fisherman Bay entrance is completely covered by the channel marker symbol. Should one just avoid these tight passes and find safer destinations and routes?
Handy... You know, after rowing 3 or 4 miles I can say that rowing a sailboat is just not my idea of fun. Bolero's setup worked fine and thankfully Britton was nowhere to be seen as my technique was sloppy and tired from the beginning to the end. But we did get home.BALANCE wrote:I bet those oars came in mighty handy! And I bet technique was the last thing on our mind. Thank goodness it was just a ding.
Bill
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Nothing beats your own eyes and ears. GPS is an excellent backup. GPS itself can be a lot more accurate than +/- 200 feet. It all depends on the local reception and how the satellites are feeling on a particular day. Whether the data in the map database is that accurate I don't know. Usually, the GPS can tell you how accurate it is at any given time. If it says it is good to ten feet then it is. Again, that is just the lat/long numbers. The map data might not be nearly that accurate.How do you all actually use your GPS.
Proceed cautiously and at a pace that gives you a chance to avoid obstacles. That might mean proceeding at half a knot or simply avoiding dodgy areas. Use your judgement. I would definitely not trust the GPS blindly.Should one just avoid these tight passes and find safer destinations and routes?
I wouldn't trust paper charts at that level of detail (+/-20 feet) either. Eyes and ears are your best bet.
Just because you can't see me doesn't mean that I can't see you.thankfully Britton was nowhere to be seen
Re: How not to navigate a reef
Regarding the "off by 200 feet" comments, that's more about the chart data. I really should have said "chart data" not the inaccuracy of the GPS positioning itself. Looking at my older post, I should be more clear about this. Sorry for the confusion.
The chart data in the waters I'm in definitely are from another age with imprecise measurements.
What I was trying to say was that if I saw a rock in the chart, I would move a few hundred feet farther away from the "exact" position the chart said the rock was located. Many times, I ended up a thousand feet away from the rock when I finally could see it underwater. Or closer than I wanted to be! Narrow channels, the charts for those areas do tend to be more accurate.
- Case
The chart data in the waters I'm in definitely are from another age with imprecise measurements.
What I was trying to say was that if I saw a rock in the chart, I would move a few hundred feet farther away from the "exact" position the chart said the rock was located. Many times, I ended up a thousand feet away from the rock when I finally could see it underwater. Or closer than I wanted to be! Narrow channels, the charts for those areas do tend to be more accurate.
- Case
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Re: How not to navigate a reef
Navigation is the assembly of pieces of information into a correct awareness of where you are, and where you are going. GPS is one piece of the puzzle. What you see outside the boat, and what you see on a paper chart are two more. Radar can be another one. You scan all the sources of information available to you and keep processing them. Depending on the quality of the information you weigh one more than the other. But in the end, if they don't jive, you keep digging until you figure out why. I navigate for a living and for fun. The above has been my mantra for decades. 200 feet is close enough for 99% of what I do. Double it and add a little for mom and the kids. If it gets closer, I have to be able to see. (No instrument approaches to a slip in boats.) In your case you went inside the comfort zone feet without confirmation from another source..... As Case said it's not the GPS, it's the chart. That rock was displayed where some MIT grad THOUGHT it was.
Out there, alone, there is only truth.