System 3 Epoxy

[Ryan]

For those of you that use or have used System 3 epoxy for large repair jobs (ie recore, etc.) project, have you found that you can use the standard S3 epoxy resin, or do you have to use the Silvertip variety? I have read several reviews and the S3 epoxy book, but I'd like to hear some real world opinions from someone not trying to sell me epoxy!

[dasein668]

I used the standard system 3 when I glassed my decks (7 1/2 gallon kit). The stuff worked ok, but it was hard to measure accurately?more of a problem with small batch sizes?and I had one batch that didn't kick, and another that took a loooooooong time to cure.

Never used the Silvertip stuff.

[Rachel]

I'm sure others will have more information, but I'll start by saying that I recored a good part of my Montgomery 17's deck with the "regular" System III epoxy. At the time (1999) I wasn't as aware of all my choices (not as Internet savvy), so it was between that and West, and I went with S3 because a friend recommended it, and I liked the idea of being able to mark cups and mix fairly accurately myself (because of the more tolerant ratio).

It worked fine for me, but I was a rank novice at the time; maybe I should say it *seemed* to work fine ;-) I did also like being able to mix in the various filler types and amounts myself. (Is Silvertip as flexible?)

At any rate, the Silvertip hadn't been invented yet.

I'll be curious to see what others have to say about it.

--- Rachel

[Ryan]

Thanks for the input. I am trying to decide which brand of epoxy to use for an upcoming recore and of cousre cost is an issue as long as I get a product worth using. The Silvertip is quite a bit more expensive than the regular S3 resin, hence the quesion. Thanks again!

[Tim]

The advantage of Silvertip Laminating Resin is that is is of somewhat lower viscosity, and therefore makes wetting out cloth easier.

If your jobs are centered mostly around mixing putties, adhesives, and fillers, with less emphasis on pure laminating, then the regular S3 resin is the best choice. A typical recore job would be heavy on the adhesive/putty side of the equation, with less laminating.

And you can easily use normal S3 for laminating, too. It's no thicker than most of your standard choices. It is definitely thicker than Silvertip, but there's no requirement to use the Silvertip for laminating.

All epoxies are not created equal. Each has its own characteristics, which make themselves clear the more you use the product. Over time, one can choose a favorite based on how they use the product.

[Rachel]

While we're on the subject (as I can feel a recore in my future :-), has anyone tried the "Premium no-blush" from Progressive Epoxy Polymers? It's one I've looked into while doing web research. Not that blush is so bad, but on the other hand, if it can be eliminated with a good epoxy, I might be open to trying it...

www.epoxyproducts.com is their website.

By the way, I tend to agree that there's no one "best" brand. I'm just looking for input since I will probably never try them all myself. Yet, for reasons of economy, I will probably want to choose one brand and buy 5+ gallons of it.

--- Rachel

PS I should have done my research on Silvertip before commenting earlier; I was thinking it was one of those premixed compounds...

[Ryan]

Tim

That is the opinion that I have formed (between S3 and Silvertip) from my research, but it makes me feel better to hear it from folks who have used it firsthand.

Rachel

I am looking for a bulk purchase as well, and I've seen no better place on the web to get informed decisions as this.

Does anyone have experience with East Systems Epoxy? The price sure is right, but we all know you get what you pay for...

Merton's also has great prices on S3 products, but I had no dealings with them. Anyone here done business with them?

[Tim]

I should have done my research on Silvertip before commenting earlier; I was thinking it was one of those premixed compounds...

Well, while we addressed the Silvertip Laminating Resin, the Silvertip series--an application-specific family of products--also includes an adhesive compound, a metal-use compound, and, finally, a fairing putty (Quik Fair). So you weren't incorrect.

I have used quite a bit of the Quik Fair. It took a little getting used to, but I have ended up liking it quite a bit for smooth fairing. I still prefer to mix my own for thick fillers and the like, but for the last coat or two of surfacing compound, the Quik Fair is pretty nice stuff.

[dasein668]

I still prefer to mix my own for thick fillers and the like, but for the last coat or two of surfacing compound, the Quik Fair is pretty nice stuff.

Oh, but the color... they must have spent years of R&D coming up with the most foul shade of purple imaginable...

[george]

Speaking of mixing your own, what is the easiest to sand epoxy mix to use for above the waterline use? and below the waterline?

I have a gallon of West 105 and lots of collodial silica, and am thinking of using that instead of buying fairing compound for some dings.

Is that OK for below the waterline? Is there an easier to sand additive?

[Tim]

Fairing compounds should be mostly microballoons, which are meant for the purpose and are easy to sand. The silica is a thixotropic additive that is normally required in order to cause your mix to thicken appropriately, but a compound made from only silica will be ridiculously hard to sand.

In general, most fairing and filling compounds are best made by mixing in a good slug of microballoons, and then, to fine tune the thickness and bring the whole thing together, add some silica as needed at the end.

Stay away from the ultralight fillers (West 410??), which will soften if used in areas that get a lot of sun, such as decks or beneath dark paints. Stick with the all-purpose purple microballoons.

[Figment]

Ditto what's been said above.
If nothing else, the lower viscosity makes the mixing of resin and hardener a bit less arduous.